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ARCHIVED DISCUSSION FROM 11/5/2001 All times are U.S. Mountain Time (Yesterday's Discussion.) ORO (11/5/01; 23:33:48MT - usagold.com msg#: 64791) Another bit of FFO idiocies The group discussed whether the exhortation by the Russian minister to his people to dump their Greenspan-backs in favor of euro-dims (which was very badly received among Russians, who generally suspect anything said by a government official as to what is good for their finances) would have a substantial impact on the euro-dollar exchange rate. Why? because they thought the $60 billion of internal circulation dollars in Russia could have an effect on exchange rates.Someone at the Mises Institute pointed out that the strict bank disclosure rules for exchange of old currency to new currency would cause people who have some $250 billion of cash from sources they would rather not explain, to do two things: spend the money rather than exchange it, exchange it for dollars.I bet the recent bout of price rises and GDP growth in Europe has much more to do with a last minute "use it or lose it" spending spree than any development of a lasting nature in the economy. As the conversion date nears, we may find fewer people left who have not spent or exchanged their old currency, and the EU economy could very well tank by Christmass.A small bit of an observation, in this May 2001 meeting, a war in the Afghan-Pakistan-India triangle was treated as a fait accompli. Black Blade (11/5/01; 23:28:41MT - usagold.com msg#: 64790) Fed May Cut Rates By a Half Point Today to Lowest Since 1961 http://quote.bloomberg.com/fgcgi.cgi?ptitle=Economies&s1=blk&tp=ad_topright_econ&T=markets_bfgcgi_content99.ht&s2=ad_right1_economies&bt=ad_position1_economies&middle=ad_frame2_economies&s=AO_dunxOnRmVkIE1h Snippit:Washington, Nov. 6 (Bloomberg) -- Federal Reserve policy makers, meeting today, may reduce the benchmark U.S. interest rate to 2 percent in order to fortify an economy almost certainly in recession. Fed Chairman Alan Greenspan and his fellow central bankers will probably cut the target rate on overnight loans between banks a half percentage point from the current 2.5 percent, according to themedian forecast of 85 analysts surveyed by Bloomberg News. A drop in the overnight rate usually pushes down rates for mortgages and business loans -- help for an economy that shrank at a 0.4 percent annual pace in the third quarter, the first narrowing since 1993. Economists expect it to contract again in the final three months of the year, and the Fed is seen as the last line of defense to give the economy a lift. Even after lowering rates nine times this year, the Fed still needs ``to arrest sliding investor and business confidence and prevent the recession from getting worse,'' said Sung Won Sohn, chief economist at Wells Fargo & Co in Minneapolis. Black Blade: This does not look like a bustling robust economy by any measure. Higher unemployment, terrible NAPM numbers, low consumer confidence, cash withdrawals from Mutual Funds accelerating, and growing consumer and corporate debt. In a word - "GRIM"Golden Dreams All! Netking (11/5/01; 23:21:49MT - usagold.com msg#: 64789) Galearis - Ag ponderings http://www.cbot.com/cbot/www/prod_detail/0,1499,14+58+141+44,00.html Galearis(64773)Howdy, Why not 1,000 Oz bars of silver in short supply? Good question but for a start the 1,000's may only in fact be 880 ounces, and done all quite legally too!To quote from contract specifications (per link); "Deliverable Grades Refined silver assaying not less than 999 fineness and made up of one or more brands and markings officially listed by the exchange. Each bar must weigh 1,000 troy ounces. The total bar cannot vary from a 1,000 troy oz weight by more than 12 percent". . . which means that those who do take delivery and pay for 1,000 and may get as a little as 880, the shorts would have to call that a "discount"(bad joke I know!). To me the 100 oz's being sought & going first indicates a strong retail demand, this is good & will have a ripple effect. As for us down here . . . the latest this week from the Ag suppliers; "We are expecting strong demand on silver until after Christmas please give us a call back then" . . . wonder what's different about "this Christmas". I have a feeling it will not be too long before "things happen", most reliable market timing except "Claytons seems to indicate Oct-Nov 2001 as a major bottom for the POS, but I guess we shall see. I think the name of the game is to keep buying physical, if per chance you get to buy it a little cheaper for the very short term then that is good too.- Cheers Netking ORO (11/5/01; 23:16:29MT - usagold.com msg#: 64788) BR549 - EM Bonds Distressed bonds are really nice. The restructured Argentine bonds at 7% will be sold in the aftermarket by their current holders, having already realized a 40% loss from par. Once the debt is restructured to 7-8%, the bonds at a 40% discount would have an effective yield of 12% and enjoy US and IMF guarantees. Which comes down to not bad at all. In general, debt service in EMs is about 14% at the moment, vs. 11% in prior years. Mr Gresham (11/5/01; 23:07:15MT - usagold.com msg#: 64787) Saville on inflation http://www.321gold.com/editorials/saville/110501/saville110501.html Stop it you guys! Too much good stuff here tonight -- you know how I hate to fall behind in reading!Congratulations, Leigh -- you know a good thing when you see it. ORO (11/5/01; 23:05:00MT - usagold.com msg#: 64786) escapethematrix - Forum of Nincompoops http://www.ffo.ru/stock/eindex.html The FFO has a broad collection of politicos and yes men economists to pat them on their intellectual shoulders and tell them that "political will" will triumph over the laws of economics. They promote an emotional anti market Mahatir-like attitude and forecast the destruction of the US economy. Invited dignitaries in the FFO's include mostly economic academics who hope to be the central planners of the future, a menagerie of ambassadors, and the occasional law firm. Oddly, they did not invite many people from the private sector nor did they discuss much those issues that most affect investment.Only a couple of the people in the confab had anything positive to say about the US economy or the US in general. Speculation as to China's gold stock put it as up to 15,000 tonnes.At this meeting, no one for a second stopped to think that countries do not trade with each other but people and corporations do. The whole of their discussion was of government's actions to "build the economy". None pointed out that if a step was taken by government it would be precisely that which people did not think worthwhile, otherwise, they would already be doing it. None stopped to say that government allocation of resources removes them from people's use in their daily pursuit of profit, and therefore government action in the economy begins by eliminating future growth (all of which comes from profits - having more than what you started with), and ends with the waste of the resources. An efficient government can achieve the same results by taking a percentage of each person and company's production and dumping it into the sea. That would greatly reduce labor expenditure in government.Here are people they pointed out as "partners".General Manager Arab Research Center Dr. Ali D. Al-Shamali Plenipotentiary and Extraordinary Ambassador of the Republic of VenezuelaLopes Mieres Francisco The private investor Munir Al Debs Plenipotentiary and Extraordinary Ambassador of Republic of Indonesia John Ario Katili Plenipotentiary and Extraordinary Ambassador of the Republic of Malaysia Datuk Yahya Baba Needless to say, the presence of many representatives of economic basket case weavers is a demonstration of the quality of thinking behind the "political will". The CoinGuy (11/5/01; 22:57:38MT - usagold.com msg#: 64785) Black Blade #64782 your too fast for me...The CoinGuy The CoinGuy (11/5/01; 22:55:30MT - usagold.com msg#: 64784) Black Blade et al... http://news.ft.com/ft/gx.cgi/ftc?pagename=View&c=Article&cid=FT3GTMWPOTC&live=true&tagid=FTDO9DHMZJC Black Blade,Check out the link; you may want to put this one on "Bone Pile" alert...escapethematrix,Thanks for the Russian link...I found the "organizing FEE" under Terms and Conditions of Participation to be interesting...US DOLLARS ARE NOT ACCEPTED.Leigh,Congrats on the contest, didn't check in in time to get an entry in myself. Not that I had a chance... Great Job!!ALL,Trying to enjoy a vacation, but with the market in a moonshot, I'm "LITERALLY" taking it in the shorts. UGH!Best Regards,The CoinGuy Chris Powell (11/5/01; 22:55:15MT - usagold.com msg#: 64783) Howe case survives hearing on dismissal motions http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gata/message/912 A full report from Boston.To subscribe to GATA's dispatches by email and get them immediately so you don't have to go look for them, send an email to:gata-subscribe@yahoogroups.com Black Blade (11/5/01; 22:53:05MT - usagold.com msg#: 64782) Ford Considers Deeper White-Collar Layoffs Ford Motor (nyse: F) is considering shedding up to 20% or 8,000 of its salaried U.S. white-collar employees as part of an overhaul of its North American operations, according to the Financial Times. Details of the layoffs will not be announced until early 2002, but Ford is reportedly hoping to save $1 billion through reductions in its white-collar staff. Black Blade: The "Bone Pile" continues to grow daily. BMC and SBC announced additional layoffs today as well. This is not a sign of a robust economy - or is it? In a word - "GRIM" BR549 (11/5/01; 22:52:12MT - usagold.com msg#: 64781) CB's—Bank of India CB emulates CB of Argentina http://quote.bloomberg.com/fgcgi.cgi?ptitle=Top%20Financial%20News&s1=blk&tp=ad_topright_topfin&T=markets_bfgcgi_content99.ht&s2=ad_right1_topfin&bt=ad_position1_topfin&middle=ad_frame2_topfin&s=AO_cvQhWAQmFua3Mg "Investors in India's government bonds have earned an average of about 19 percent this year, according to the total return index calculated by investment bank ICICI Securities and Finance Ltd., the highest since 1997. The benchmark Mumbai stock index has tumbled 23 percent in the same time. "``As long as the RBI and the government of India keep accommodative conditions, bond yields will fall,'' said Dhawal Dalal, who has been buying three-year and 10-year bonds for the 16 billion rupees of Indian debt he helps manage at DSP Merrill Lynch Investment Management Co. "So much for the post I did on the Bank of India Central Bank earlier. BOI are going into hock big time in cahoots with M-L.They're all crooked, I tell ya’. Will they be forced to renegotiate that 19% bond interest rate via "default?"If you are crazy enough to buy some high risk CB bonds, would you buy the Indian Bonds at 19% or the one's being offered at Argentina's new rate of 7%? (Given that India has not defaulted 10 times akready)The more that I look at who runs these CB's, the more convinced I am that it does not matter. The real question is—are the Central Banks use of derivatives going to bring the world economic system down? Regardless who are running the CB's, the result will be the same.You can buy a lot of phyical Gold with this CB "paper".BR549BTW-The only thing dirtier than the CB's perhaps, is the NY Mayoral race. I get the NYC Channel on my dish and the name calling is second to none between Green (he's really pink) and no-Gold Bloomberg. Black Blade (11/5/01; 22:40:33MT - usagold.com msg#: 64780) Market Futures Up on Stellar CISCO Earnings Not much in the way of news tonight. CISCO beat the street by 2 cents (Pro Forma). This is on lowered earnings by about 76%. This quarters losses are a mere $286 million excluding writedowns. CISCO should only loses a billion or so dollars this year. Go CISCO! The markets took the news quite well as techs rose smartly in after hours trading. Who said "Irrational Exuberance" was dead? Meanwhile, the market awaits the FED's rate cut tomorrow. This could be a double-edged sword. If the cut is only 25 bps, then there might be disapointment that the cut wasn't larger. If the cut is 50 bps, then the market players might wonder if this is a move out of desperation. Then again maybe Amazon.Com or some other tech wreck stock will beat earnings by penny (Pro Forma) and lose a mere billion or so dollars along with an announcement that they will add to the "Bone Pile" and it's off to the races as "Irrational" investors throw cash at the market. Hmmm...- Black BladeHi Leigh! Saw you sneaking around the Castle Treasury! Congrats! Netking (11/5/01; 22:40:15MT - usagold.com msg#: 64779) Auspec auspec(64770) - Great work work McAuspec(tor) on THE FED "ownership" . . . when you finish the project you can reveal to us the owners of the others too, as far as the clan can see yes . . . but are we all ready for those answers?(rhetorical).- Netking uponroof (11/5/01; 22:27:05MT - usagold.com msg#: 64778) GATA A tough day it seems,JPM/Chase.....alas, too convoluted, too hard to connect the dots for a mere Judge (who probably has a loan with them).Ahhh, but what of the man who claims "Central Banks stand ready to lease gold should the need arise"? Surley the true intent in this outlandish statement deserves carefull judicial discovery. Unless of course he is above the law, which is probably what the Judge is checking into. *********We are witnessing market intervention at historic levels, yet no one sees or cares to understand, much less call to attention as it might be 'unpatriotic'.Reminds me of Clinton's obscene behavior which far too many saw, yet refused to condemn for fear of confusing character with ability.And so we wander deeper into the lowlands with our highly valued, very very expensive, selective vision glasses. Which we put on a convenient payment plan through the hot new, highly leveraged, Moral Relativism Trust Co. We are told: no more moral hazzards. All debts paid free of charge, no consequences or penalties.....ever again. Too good to be true? You bet it is. Hang in there gang. BR549 (11/5/01; 21:43:50MT - usagold.com msg#: 64777) 11/05 19:24 Argentina to Extend Maturities 3 Years in Debt Swap http://quote.bloomberg.com/fgcgi.cgi?ptitle=Top%20Financial%20News&s1=blk&tp=ad_topright_topfin&T=markets_bfgcgi_content99.ht&s2=ad_right1_topfin&bt=ad_position1_topfin&middle=ad_frame2_topfin&s=AO_ctsxU7QXJnZW50 The "most corrupt" of the CB's to date. See how its done. Stop paying your agreed to rate of interest and unilaterally renegotiate via Debt Swap. Derivatives, swaps, restructuring,cheating, manipulating, the governmnet providing tax incentives, they're all located in Buenos Aires. How many individual suckers, I mean investors, are going to get caught holding this empty sack? "Argentina said it will offer holders of $60 billion of bonds new securities that have longer maturities and pay lower interest. The exchange, which rating agencies say would be tantamount to a default, is aimed at domestic bondholders. The new obligations will pay a third the interest of the old debt and mature three years later, Economy Minister Domingo Cavallo said. The government will provide more details Tuesday and later announce another swap targeting international holders. Argentina plans to restructure at least $95 billion of bonds to regain investor confidence and reduce financing costs to start reviving the $280 billion economy. The country needs to reduce the amount of outstanding bonds by as much as 47 percent to be able to pay its debts, economists said. ``The only thing we are seeking is to ensure payments over a viable base,'' Cavallo told business executives at the state- owned Banco de la Nacion. ``It's a question of telling the truth.'' BR-Yeah, right. The truth are what these CB's are known for around the world."``Individual investors are not likely to go for this,'' said Rafael Ber, an analyst at Argentine Research. ``The banks are under pressure to do it.'' Ratings companies have said that any exchange that reduces the value of investors' holdings would be considered a default. Investors have said a plan to back new securities with tax guarantees may give bonds not included in the swap a lower priority when the government pays its bills. "BR-Default? No, it can't be. Not for the 10th time? I guess this buys time for Goldman and JPMC to off load their losers on some unsuspecting investor at some price. The funds at the IMF must have dried up.I still smell BAILOUT when the hedgers run out of time.BR549 site steward (11/5/01; 21:33:55MT - usagold.com msg#: 64776) From the Gilded Opinion: "Who Owns and Controls the Federal Reserve?" http://www.usagold.com/FederalReserve.html Although not as "fun" as other theories, it "is" what it "is".R. site steward (11/5/01; 21:24:26MT - usagold.com msg#: 64775) Elaboration http://quote.bloomberg.com/pgcgi.cgi?T=markets_newsfeat99.ht=&ptitle=EMU%20Top%20Stories&touch=1&s=AO_cqFxb9RHVpc2Vu "When you deliver credibility, confidence and price stability, you're helping your own economic growth." --Jean-Claude Trichet, head of the French central bank speaking in London.Credibility involves such elements as that portion of an overall system (distinctly NOT in effect in the current dollar system) which allows for the pricing of gold to seek its proper level -- reflecting, concurrently, the scarcity of physical gold and the abundance of currency in an affluent society of uncertain and shifting aggregate creditworthiness.In this light, 'price stability' should be seen as referring not to maintaining the singular price of gold (which must surely be expected and allowed to rise markedly through the coming transition), but to the level of prices on market goods and services in general.It incrementally points toward something that you have seen described variously over time here at this website by some knowledgeable posters as "free gold".R. Cavan Man (11/5/01; 21:02:18MT - usagold.com msg#: 64774) auspec Thanks for that list of "giants". Galearis (11/5/01; 20:50:01MT - usagold.com msg#: 64773) @ Netking If this is so, then why are 100 ounce silver bars in short supply? This is an odd question to my mind. What size bars would a company buy (like Kodak, for example) use vs. the best size for storage and a liquidity size compromise for you and I. That's easy. Industrial demand is for granules (Europe) or 1000 oz bars. The rest of the refined silver would be in smaller weight sizes of more interest to investors. The dearth of 100 ozers would seem to imply that dealers are now running out - and refineries must wait for the increase in demand from dealers to start a new run of production. Given the low paper prices, that demand is now oh so slowly showing up.The supply would vary, obviously, regionally with New Zealand, for example, not swimming in the stuff.If you phone a refinery about 100 ozers they will ask you how much you want (knowing that it likely isn't 50 million oz..). They seem to be waiting on the demand.And additional: China is importing silver from Australia etc. for re-refining and "exporting" it back. There's the source of the silver dishoarding by China. Lotsa silver bugs in China.And allow me add my congratulations to Leigh, that's real money there! (smile)G-nightG. megatron (11/5/01; 20:33:13MT - usagold.com msg#: 64772) Verdict? It seems to be a undecided outcome 'vibe' here. Even though the 2 charges against JP Moron were not allowed to proceed, there is still the small matter of the other 'defendents'. It would seem to offer a glimmer of a chance, no? auspec (11/5/01; 20:33:12MT - usagold.com msg#: 64771) GATA/Worst Case Scenario We will at least be thrown a juicy bone, upon which to chow down! NO SHUTOUT! auspec (11/5/01; 20:28:23MT - usagold.com msg#: 64770) Chart of Who "Owns" the Federal Reserve/BR549/Pandagold/All http://www.save-a-patriot.org/files/view/whofed.html This is exactly what I mean when I say "All roads lead to..................London".This was dredged up by a friend at cafe Chat and fits very nicely w Pandagold's # 64733.Suggestion: Copy this and keep handy for eternal reference.We must stop thinking in terms of Alan Green$pandex and the various marionettes he well represents, and look deeper to the masters behind the scenes.Don't you think EVERY American should KNOW who is represented by the policies, personnel and actions of our Fed? I do. Who has the foggiest {ha} clue that this isn't even a Federal Govt entity? It is also not a 'Reserve'. Much less who owns/controls it.This article, put together with Pandagold's #64733 speaks pretty loudly about US/Brit/French connections via the Rothschilds just for starters. How many banks are 'nationalized' as Sir Belgian states his country's has been? He also states it really doesn't matter much, because CONTROL is actually just as effective as ownership. We link 'London' to S.A., which isn't very hard to do, or Canada, Australia etc., and the picture clears: MACROVISION!There is common talk of 3 or so dynastic families that lord it over the rest of the world. Can I say Rosthchilds, Rockefellers, and Oppenheimers {?} w/o causing a scene? Who else would come to mind for other foolhardy and curious souls that might venture a guess?Know your enemy, golden dreams!auspector Netking (11/5/01; 20:18:44MT - usagold.com msg#: 64769) Why are silver prices so low? - Don Stott http://www.gold-eagle.com/gold_digest_01/stott110701.html Interesting piece, but forget the bit about China, most of us know the PRC refine from imported Ag concentrates. - NetkingSnippet:". . . . If this is so, then why are 100 ounce silver bars in short supply? Why is the US Mint acting very hedgy about how much silver it can lay its hands on for continued production of US silver Eagles? Beautiful A-Mark silver rounds, which used to go for fifty cents over spot are gone, and now American silver Eagles have risen in price over the last week by a quarter. No one even hints that the US government has a single ounce of silver as a reserve, because it probably doesn't . . . "------------------------------------------------------------Well done Leigh, you silver bug you!(smile) site steward (11/5/01; 20:03:53MT - usagold.com msg#: 64768) Nearer with every step http://www.chinaonline.com/topstories/011105/1/C01110307.asp HEADLINE CHINA: Gold retailers no longer need licenses(5 November 2001) Effective Nov. 1, China will implement a new system for regulating gold retailing....----Liberalisation of the gold market in China continues, with greater reforms in the market targeted for January 2002.R. site steward (11/5/01; 19:51:05MT - usagold.com msg#: 64767) Holger Jensen's latest look at issues "Inside Foreign Affairs" http://www.usagold.com/gildedopinion/Jensen/20011105.html Mr Jensen writes:"In a changing world, a new way to wage war........That means divesting ourselves of old-fashioned "legacy forces" and adopting "new concepts of war-fighting, new capabilities and new ways of organizing our forces" to face the dual challenge of liquidating terrorist networks and preparing for future threats."Part of that preparation on an individual basis surely involves taking a more responsible and conservative stance with respect to the risk-exposure of financial positions.In this piece, Jensen also replies to the question from a reader: "Why can't the United Nations send a peacekeeping force to make Israel and the Palestinians quit fighting?"(click URL above for more) site steward (11/5/01; 19:38:57MT - usagold.com msg#: 64766) The latest StormWatch commentary called "Countermeasures" by Jim Puplava is now available here at USAGOLD http://www.usagold.com/gildedopinion/puplava/20011102.html Is your portfolio structured to weather the potential unfolding of a hyperinflationary storm?Excerpt:"During times of war, the government usually runs a budget deficit as it spends more than it takes in taxes. The added stimulus through deficit spending and the monetization of debt creates inflation. It is this fear of inflation that has kept long-term interest rates from coming down. Unable to bring down interest rates the Treasury has intervened by its decision to stop selling 30-year bonds. ... With the economy worsening, the Fed is flooding the market with money in an effort to meet a rise in the demand for money from companies and investors who are showing an increase in preference for liquidity. This would normally raise the cost of money. By shrinking the supply of bonds, or in other words, by limiting their sale, the government is trying to lower the cost of money, by driving down its price." escapethematrix (11/5/01; 19:07:17MT - usagold.com msg#: 64765) Sounds like Russian "political will" has plans for the Euro....... http://www.ffo.ru/EC/eindex.html Snippet:The most important theme, which interests many most famous politicians and banking circles, engaged in the discussion of these issues and confirmed their participation at the Reception, is "Substitution of the U.S. dollars with Euro in internal circulation of Russia".Presence the representatives of Arabian and Asian countries as Honoured guests underlines the equal adherence of Russia to cooperation with all interested countries, and the significance of Russia's meaning for Europe as transport and multimedia corridor when working with Asia.Themes for the discussion-Russia's integration into European financial system and the development of interbank cooperation and correspondent relationships. -Removal of the sphere of payments for products and services from the dollar zone to Euro on the territory of Russia. -Shifting European foreign contracts of Russian companies to Euro. -Investment attraction from Europe to Russia - new proposals in the process of privatization. -European investment funds - principles of functioning at the unified area. The most attractive objects - for investments from Europe. Oh yeah, sorry but....US DOLLARS are NOT ACCEPTEDSir Trail Guide: Thanks for all your thoughts and efforts,they are very much appreciated by a great many, I'm sure. R Powell (11/5/01; 18:38:00MT - usagold.com msg#: 64764) GATA News Our Gold-Eagle neighbors have also found the same Marketwatch report but are still wondering why there is no word from GATA. Some have speculated that the court may have instituted a gag order. Even if this were true, wouldn't Chris Powell still be able to tell us that this was the case? I'd like to hear what happened from as many sources as possible. Also, what sort of move will we see tomorrow from the Greenman and the FOMC? And, how will the stock markets and the dollar react to whatever happens? How low can rates go before the dollar weakens? Rich Gold Trail Update (11/5/01; 18:31:03MDT - Msg ID:64763) The Gold Trail Discussion has been Updated The Gold Trail Discussion has been updated. Click on the link to read the latest updates. segel_flieger (11/5/01; 17:35:29MT - usagold.com msg#: 64762) Court hearing on GATA suit CBS Marketwatch posted a short article about the hearingtoday on the GATA suit. In brief, the judge dismissed twocounts against JP Moron, and would rule later if the casewould be allowed to proceed.The CBS commentary was not optimistic about the case goingforward, but then these guys have always a real hoot withtheir reporting on Gold; "Gold tumbled $0.30 today in panicselling", or "Gold inched ahead by $15 today in quiet, lack-luster action" :^)http://cbs.marketwatch.com/news/story.asp?guid=%7BD0821B98%2DBA59%2D44F1%2DB3EE%2D2859D5AA6F1D%7D&siteid=mktw R Powell (11/5/01; 17:32:21MT - usagold.com msg#: 64761) GATA News Go to Daily Market Report here at Usagold, then click on "Gold Price Fixing" for a CBS Marketwatch report. Basically, the judge was not overwhelmingly convinced but hasn't decided to discard it yet. He also wonders IF some of the defendants can be brought to court to face any charges. I would have thought this might have been an immediate concern and one that the judge would have resolved by now. Silly me, why should I think there is any competency in our legal system. So we wait some more. Rich auspec (11/5/01; 17:32:00MT - usagold.com msg#: 64760) Leigh You raiding the Castle again?Congrats! auspec (11/5/01; 16:57:38MT - usagold.com msg#: 64759) Pandagold Thank you much, your post #64733 was quite an appetizer. Where do I find Marcus Angelicus at Gold-Eagle and does he have much more of this nature? There is a very good reason that I keep a file handy of much of your posted wisdom, you too Belgian! CoBra(too) (11/5/01; 16:20:13MT - usagold.com msg#: 64758) @ R Powell - re GATA (Reg Howe) TODAY! Hi Rich, No news as yet from the source ... all waitingfor clues ... best cb2PS: Congrats Leigh - much deserved and all the best! R Powell (11/5/01; 14:45:44MT - usagold.com msg#: 64757) Leigh Leigh- good work! Another way to protect and increase your family's wealth is to collect as much gold and silver from USAGOLD contests as possible. Congrats. Has anyone any word of how the GATA case was received (or not) by the court today???? Whatever the outcome, my thanks to all those supporting the efforts in any capacity. Rich nickel62 (11/5/01; 14:35:12MT - usagold.com msg#: 64756) bj An amazing piece of information. . I have seen many of these articles appear seperately but had not seen the entire group put into a timeline. Leigh (11/5/01; 14:13:04MT - usagold.com msg#: 64755) Best of the Gold Trail Wow, I'm in shock! Thank you so much, MK. I hope Trail Guide is on safe ground today and out of the path of the hurricane. Hipplebeck (11/5/01; 14:11:57MT - usagold.com msg#: 64754) To Leigh Congratulations!!!I, too, am comforted and reassured by your presence. USAGOLD (11/5/01; 13:37:02MT - usagold.com msg#: 64753) A Clean Sweep for Leigh. . . . . Leigh, you are correct and win the silver. Gold Trail Msg# 117 is the one that made the Quarterly Review and our first entry in the "Best of the Gold Trail" series, and since you chose for precisely the same reasons we did per below, you win the gold as well.-------------This simple thinker, though appreciative of Trail Guide's efforts to educate us in economictheory and world economic practice, has an eye on her own little portfolio. How can it beadjusted to guard her family's small wealth now and in the future? That is why when each GoldTrail message comes out, I click over and search for clues. Message 117, which containsanswers to questions from MK, gives a number of practical hints:"The leverage today will be in a physical gold position, not any other form of gold ownership.By accumulating gold today, we are truly walking in the footsteps of giants, advancing withthem as they work thru this singular, long term political move.""While a U.S. physical gold free market will be locally encouraged, it will most likely simply bea shadow function of Euro Gold practices.""I also expect a European gold coin to become real usable legal tender (not a collector item) andbe named the 'EuroLand.'""A U.S. workout to cover its failed paper gold position will most likely be using gold industryprofits. It could be done via 'windfall tax legislation,' plain tax or part of any variety ofemergency financial arrangement. All built in order to allow our current gold reserves to berepriced at higher world levels and help our dollar stay somewhere in the next currency system.Considering the size of the failure, real gold will outperform any and all investments once this allgets started. However, we should not be naive and not expect some serious taxes of our own onbullion sales. Still, only just enough so as to keep currency tender protected from beingsupplanted with illegal gold use. Illegal in that too high a rate and everyone would use gold inbarter and stop paying their capital gains taxes all together."-----Thanks, Trail Guide, for your generous sharing of knowledge. Yes, Gold is Good. END QUOTE- - - - - - - --And thank you, Leigh, for being here. I know I speak for many when I say your long term presence has been of great value to all of us. BR549 (11/5/01; 13:07:45MT - usagold.com msg#: 64752) These countries should publish figures on their use of derivatives contracts to clarify the costs of borrowing to finance their budget deficits --- Austria, Belgium, Canada, Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, Ireland, Italy, the Netherlands, Portugal, Spain, Sweden, and the U.K. http://quote.bloomberg.com/fgcgi.cgi?ptitle=Swaps%20Focus&touch=1&s1=blk&tp=ad_topright_bbco&T=markets_fgcgi_content99.ht&s2=ad_right1_bbco&bt=ad_bottom_bbco&s=AO_XX7xV6Q291bnRy "Countries should publish figures on their use of derivatives contracts to clarify the costs of borrowing to finance their budget deficits, the International Securities Market Association said. Countries should provide statistics on what they do with derivatives, or financial instruments derived from debt, equity or commodities, according to a report by Gustavo Piga for ISMA, the 570-member trade association for the securities industry, and the Council on Foreign Relations, a research organization. ``Sovereign borrowers' arguments for withholding information on derivative activity are often either irrelevant or specious,'' said Piga, an economics professor at the University of Macerata in Italy, in the study. Banks must report their holdings in the $95 trillion derivatives market to the Bank for International Settlements, the world banking watchdog owned by 50 central banks. Countries aren't required to say how they use them. European Union countries are required under the Maastricht Treaty to keep the ratio of their deficits to gross domestic product to below 3 percent. Traders use derivatives contracts to guard against swings in interest rates, currencies, or stocks. Governments can use them to lower their borrowing costs and reduce the average length of time before their debt must be repaid. France, for instance, expects to save 200 million euros in debt costs next year by using swaps to reduce the average maturity of its bonds, the finance ministry said in September. By revealing the details of the swap agreements countries can clarify the amount of interest they owe on their debt, Piga said in the 150-page report. Countries are using more derivatives, Piga said, particularly interest-rate swaps. Swaps are agreements to exchange interest payments, such as a fixed for a floating rate. Piga estimates that the 14 countries he studied had swaps with a face value of 180 billion euros ($163 billion) at the end of 1999. It's not possible to separate how much countries use swaps from the BIS category of ``non-financial customers,'' though those institutions account for $4.315 trillion of swaps, he said. The countries he studied were Austria, Belgium, Canada, Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, Ireland, Italy, the Netherlands, Portugal, Spain, Sweden, and the U.K. "BR-Finally, someone agrees with me that the world CB's are manipulating their books with derivatives to the extent that they need to honor some sort of accounting or reporting standard, similar to the GAAP standards used in the U.S. The above mentioned CB WEB sites are difficult to navigate and even more difficult to ascertain the extent of derivative activity. European CB's do not publish Gold activity and that makes it difficult to find out whether they are leasing, selling Gold short, or using SWAPS to bolster their balance sheets and manipulate the POG. Again, more substantiation, that the CB's all over the world are equally corrupt when it comes to manipulations for their own betterment and the concealing of financial activities in their public reporting. Wake up out there world, your local CB's are taking your pants off while you are focused on and blame the world's economic problems on the U.S. Federal Reserve.BR549 jb (11/5/01; 12:31:56MT - usagold.com msg#: 64751) 911 the following report on what may and may not have been knowen about 911 adds to the pieces that geo w bush ,etc knew what was going on and they did nothing to stop it.it has all to do with oil and money,and pipielines.the usa gov't has committed treason(this is not the first time,and iam certainly not the first to say that) and should be charged.looks to to me that gold and silver are the only save investments unless you have shares in caryle."Oh Lucy! – You Gotta Lotta ‘Splainin To Do" IF CIA AND THE GOVERNMENT WEREN’T INVOLVED IN THE SEPTEMBER 11ATTACKS WHAT WERE THEY DOING?Bin Laden Met with the CIA in July and Walked AwaybyMichael C. Ruppert[© COPYRIGHT 2001, All Rights Reserved, Michael C. Ruppert and FromThe Wilderness Publications, www.copvcia.com. May be copied anddistributed for non-profit purposes only.] FTW, November 2, 2001 – 1200 PST -- On October 31, the French dailyLe Figaro dropped a bombshell. While in a Dubai hospital receivingtreatment for a chronic kidney infection last July, Osama bin Laden metwith a top CIA official - presumably the Chief of Station. The meeting,held in bin Laden's private suite, took place at the American hospital inDubai at a time when he was a wanted fugitive for the bombings of twoU.S. embassies and this year's attack on the U.S.S. Cole. Bin Laden waseligible for execution according to a 2000 intelligence finding issued byPresident Bill Clinton before leaving office in January. Yet on July 14th hewas allowed to leave Dubai on a private jet and there were no Navyfighters waiting to force him down. In 1985 Oliver North – the only member of the Reagan-Bush years whodoesn't appear to have a hand in the current war - sent the Navy andcommandos after terrorists on the cruise ship Achille Lauro. In his 1991autobiography "Under Fire," while describing terrorist Abu Abbas, Northwrote, "I used to wonder: how many dead Americans will it take beforewe do something?" One could look at the number of Americans Osama binLaden is alleged to have killed before September 11 and ask the samequestion.It gets worse, much worse. A more complete timeline listing crucialevents both before and after the September 11th suicide attacks, whichhave been blamed on bin Laden, establishes CIA foreknowledge of themand strongly suggests that there was criminal complicity on the part ofthe U.S. government in their execution. It also makes clear that theevents which have taken place since September 11th are based upon anagenda that has little to do with the attacks.One wonders how these events could have been ignored by the majormedia or treated as isolated incidents. Failing that, how could skillednews agencies avoid being outraged, or at least even just a littlesuspicious? 1998 and 2000 - Former President George H.W. Bush travels to SaudiArabia on behalf of the privately owned Carlyle Group, the 11th largestdefense contractor in the U.S. While there he meets privately with theSaudi royal family and the bin Laden family. [Source: Wall Street Journal,Sept. 27, 2001. See also FTW, Vol. IV, No 7 – "The Best Enemies MoneyCan Buy," - http://www.copvcia.com/members/carlyle.html. ] Feb 13, 2001 – UPI Terrorism Correspondent Richard Sale – whilecovering a trial of bin Laden's Al Q’aeda followers - reports that theNational Security Agency has broken bin Laden's encryptedcommunications. Even if this indicates that bin Laden changed systems inFebruary it does not mesh with the fact that the government insists thatthe attacks had been planned for years. May 2001 – Secretary of State Colin Powell gives $43 million in aid to theTaliban regime, purportedly to assist hungry farmers who are starvingsince the destruction of their opium crop in January on orders of theTaliban regime. [Source: The Los Angeles Times, May 22, 2001]. May, 2001 – Deputy Secretary of State Richard Armitage, a careercovert operative and former Navy Seal, travels to India on a publicizedtour while CIA Director George Tenet makes a quiet visit to Pakistan tomeet with Pakistani leader General Pervez Musharraf. Armitage has longand deep Pakistani intelligence connections and he is the recipient of thehighest civil decoration awarded by Pakistan. It would be reasonable toassume that while in Islamabad, Tenet, in what was described as "anunusually long meeting," also met with his Pakistani counterpart, Lt.General Mahmud Ahmad, head of the ISI. [Source The Indian SAPRAnews agency, May 22, 2001.] July, 2001 – Three American officials: Tom Simmons (former U.S.Ambassador to Pakistan), Karl Inderfurth (former Assistant Secretary ofState for South Asian affairs) and Lee Coldren (former State Departmentexpert on South Asia), meet with Taliban representatives in Berlin and tellthem that the U.S. is planning military strikes against Afghanistan inOctober. Also present are Russian and German intelligence officers whoconfirm the threat. [Source: The Guardian, September 22, 2001; theBBC, September 18, 2001.] Summer 2001 - According to a Sept. 26 story in Britain's The Guardian,correspondent David Leigh reported that, "U.S. department of defenseofficial, Dr. Jeffrey Starr, visited Tajikistan in January. The Guardian'sFelicity Lawrence established that US Rangers were also training specialtroops in Kyrgyzstan. There were unconfirmed reports that Tajik andUzbek special troops were training in Alaska and Montana." Summer 2001 (est.) – Pakistani ISI Chief General Mahmud (see above)orders an aide to wire transfer $100,000 to Mohammed Atta, who wasaccording to the FBI, the lead terrorist in the suicide hijackings. Mahmudrecently resigned after the transfer was disclosed in India and confirmedby the FBI. [Source: The Times of India, October 11, 2001.] June 2001 – German intelligence, the BND, warns the CIA and Israel thatMiddle Eastern terrorists are "planning to hijack commercial aircraft touse as weapons to attack important symbols of American and Israeliculture." [Source: Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung, September 14, 2001.] Summer 2001 – An Iranian man phones U.S. law enforcement to warn ofan imminent attack on the World Trade Center in the week of September9th. German police confirm the calls but state that the U.S. SecretService would not reveal any further information. [Source: German newsagency "online.ie", September 14, 2001.] August 2001 – The FBI arrests an Islamic militant linked to bin Laden inBoston. French intelligence sources confirm that the man is a keymember of bin Laden's network and the FBI learns that he has beentaking flying lessons. At the time of his arrest the man is in possession oftechnical information on Boeing aircraft and flight manuals. [Source:Reuters, September 13.] Summer 2001 – Russian intelligence notifies the CIA that 25 terroristpilots have been specifically training for suicide missions. This is reportedin the Russian press and news stories are translated for FTW by a retiredCIA officer. July 4-14, 2001 – Osama bin Laden receives treatments for kidneydisease at the American hospital in Dubai and meets with a CIA officialwho returns to CIA headquarters on July 15th. [Source: Le Figaro,October 31st, 2001.] August 2001 – Russian President Vladimir Putin orders Russian intelligenceto warn the U.S. government "in the strongest possible terms" ofimminent attacks on airports and government buildings. [Source: MS-NBCinterview with Putin, September 15.] August/September, 2001 – The Dow Jones Industrial Average dropsnearly 900 points in the three weeks prior to the attack. A major stockmarket crash is imminent. Sept. 3-10, 2001 – MS-NBC reports on September 16 that a caller to aCayman Islands radio talk show gave several warnings of an imminentattack on the U.S. by bin Laden in the week prior to 9/11. September 1-10, 2001 – 25,000 British troops and the largest BritishArmada since the Falkland Islands War, part of Operation "EssentialHarvest," are pre-positioned in Oman, the closest point on the ArabianPeninsula to Pakistan. At the same time two U.S. carrier battle groupsarrive on station in the Gulf of Arabia just off the Pakistani coast. Also atthe same time, some 17,000 U.S. troops join more than 23,000 NATOtroops in Egypt for Operation "Bright Star." All of these forces are inplace before the first plane hits the World Trade Center. [Sources: TheGuardian, CNN, FOX, The Observer, International Law Professor FrancisBoyle, the University of Illinois.] September 6-7, 2001 – 4,744 put options (a speculation that the stockwill go down) are purchased on United Air Lines stock as opposed to only396 call options (speculation that the stock will go up). This is a dramaticand abnormal increase in sales of put options. Many of the UAL puts arepurchased through Deutschebank/AB Brown, a firm managed until 1998by the current Executive Director of the CIA, A.B. "Buzzy" Krongard.[Source: The Herzliyya International Policy Institute for Counterterrorism,http://www.ict.org.il/, September 21; The New York Times; The WallStreet Journal.] September 10, 2001 - 4,516 put options are purchased on AmericanAirlines as compared to 748 call options. [Source: ICT – above] September 6-11, 2001 - No other airlines show any similar tradingpatterns to those experienced by UAL and American. The put optionpurchases on both airlines were 600% above normal. This at a time whenReuters (September 10) issues a business report stating, "Airline stocksmay be poised to take off." September 6-10, 2001 – Highly abnormal levels of put options arepurchased in Merrill Lynch, Morgan Stanley, AXA Re(insurance) whichowns 25% of American Airlines, and Munich Re. All of these companiesare directly impacted by the September 11 attacks. [Source: ICT,above; FTW, Vol. IV, No.7, October 18, 2001,http://www.copvcia.com/members/oct152001.html. ] It has been documented that the CIA, the Israeli Mossad and many otherintelligence agencies monitor stock trading in real time using highlyadvanced programs reported to be descended from Promis software. Thisis to alert national intelligence services of just such kinds of attacks.Promis was reported, as recently as June, 2001 to be in Osama binLaden's possession and, as a result of recent stories by FOX, both theFBI and the Justice Department have confirmed its use for U.S.intelligence gathering through at least this summer. This would confirmthat CIA had additional advance warning of imminent attacks. [Sources:The Washington Times, June 15, 2001; FOX News, October 16, 2001;FTW, October 26, 2001, -http://www.copvcia.com/members/magic_carpet.html; FTW, Vol. IV,No.6, Sept. 18, 2001 -http://www.copvcia.com/members/sept1801.html; FTW, Vol. 3, No 7,9/30/00 - www.copvcia.com/stories/may_2001/052401_promis.html. September 11, 2001 – Gen Mahmud of the ISI (see above), friend ofMohammed Atta, is visiting Washington on behalf of the Taliban. [Source:MS-NBC, Oct. 7.] September 11, 2001, For 35 minutes, from 8:15 AM until 9:05 AM, with itwidely known within the FAA and the military that four planes have beensimultaneously hijacked and taken off course, no one notifies thePresident of the United States. It is not until 9:30 that any Air Forceplanes are scrambled to intercept, but by then it is too late. This meansthat the National Command Authority waited for 75 minutes beforescrambling aircraft, even though it was known that four simultaneoushijackings had occurred – an event that has never happened in history.[Sources: CNN, ABC, MS-NBC, The Los Angeles Times, The New YorkTimes.] September 13, 2001 – China is admitted to the World Trade Organizationquickly, after 15 years of unsuccessful attempts. [Source: The New YorkTimes, Sept. 30, 2001.] September 15, 2001 – The New York Times reports that Mayo ShattuckIII has resigned, effective immediately, as head of the Alex (A.B) Brownunit of Deutschebank. September 29, 2001 – The San Francisco Chronicle reports that $2.5million in put options on American Airlines and United Airlines areunclaimed. This is likely the result of the suspension in trading on theNYSE after the attacks which gave the Securities and ExchangeCommission time to be waiting when the owners showed up to redeemtheir put options. October 10, 2001 – The Pakistani newspaper The Frontier Post reportsthat U.S. Ambassador Wendy Chamberlain has paid a call on the Pakistanioil minister. A previously abandoned Unocal pipeline from Turkmenistan,across Afghanistan, to the Pakistani coast, for the purpose of selling oiland gas to China, is now back on the table "in view of recent geopoliticaldevelopments." Mid October, 2001 – The Dow Jones Industrial Average, after havingsuffered a precipitous drop has recovered most of its pre-attack losses.Although still weak, and vulnerable to negative earnings reports, a crashhas been averted by a massive infusion of government spending ondefense programs, subsidies for "affected" industries and planned taxcuts for corporations. Now, let's go back to the October 31 story by Le Figaro – the one thathas Osama bin Laden meeting with a CIA officer in Dubai this June.The story says that, "Throughout his stay in the hospital, Osama BinLaden received visits from many family members [There goes the storythat he's a black sheep!] and Saudi Arabian Emirate personalities ofstatus. During this time the local representative of the CIA was seen bymany people taking the elevator and going to bin Laden's room."Several days later the CIA officer bragged to his friends about havingvisited the Saudi millionaire. From authoritative sources, this CIA agentvisited CIA headquarters on July 15tth, the day after bin Laden'sdeparture for Quetta…"According to various Arab diplomatic sources and French intelligenceitself, precise information was communicated to the CIA concerningterrorist attacks aimed at American interests in the world, including itsown territory."…"Extremely bothered, they [American intelligence officers in a meetingwith French intelligence officers] requested from their French peers exactdetails about the Algerian activists [connected to bin Laden throughDubai banking institutions], without explaining the exact nature of theirinquiry. When asked the question, "What do you fear in the comingdays?’ the Americans responded with incomprehensible silence."…"On further investigation, the FBI discovered certain plans that had beenput together between the CIA and its "Islamic friends" over the years.The meeting in Dubai is, so it would seem, consistent with ‘a certainAmerican policy.’"Even though Le Figaro reported that it had confirmed with hospital staffthat bin Laden had been there as reported, stories printed on November1 contained quotes from hospital staff that these reports were untrue.On November 1, as reported by the Ananova press agency, the CIA flatlydenied that any meeting between any CIA personnel and Osama binLaden at any time.In the most ironic twist of all, FTW has learned that Le Figaro is ownedby the Carlyle Group, the American defense contractor which employsGeorge Bush Sr., and which had as investors – until they sold their stakeon October 26 - the bin Laden family.Who do you believe? In coming stories FTW will prove to you that thiswar, which according to Dick Cheney, may not end in out lifetimes, hasbeen in the works for at least four years.Mike Ruppertwww.copvcia.com BR549 (11/5/01; 12:25:48MT - usagold.com msg#: 64750) Nationale Bank van Belgie - Banque Nationale de Belgique http://www.bnb.be/sg/En/Contact/pdf/EN1.pdf A little more info on the Bank of Belgium concerning those in charge and derivative activities.Bank generally gets a passing grade in honesty but site is difficult to navigate.In charge of CB-- shows heavy academics and either been with bank total time of with government. No outside business experience, no evidence of ties to large brokerage houses or derivative brokesters--Guy QUADEN, Governor-Banker since 1988 prior Academics.Marcia DE WACHTER, Vice Governor- Banker since 1988 prior Academics."Jean-Pierre PAUWELS, Director-Began as bureaucrat; banker since 1981Jan SMETS, Director-Career Banker since 1971Françoise MASAI, Director- Career Banker since 1971Jean HILGERS, Director / Treasurer-1986-98 Bureaucrat; joined bank 1999Peter PRAET, Director / Secretary-1971-2000 Bureaucrat; joined bank 2000"Derivatives--Poor presentation of financials makes it difficult to determine what kind of Gold manipulations have taken place. Summary indicates a cutback in derivative activities with most having to do with currency swaps as B of B moves from FRN's to Euro's. Backgrounds of some of directors shows interface experience with BIS, IMF, and Euro conversion committee. Euro activites now outnumber FRN in swaps. Interest based derivatives being cut back on in BIS survey. According to WEB site:"The net turnover recorded per business day in terms of single currency interest rate derivatives hasalmost tripled to USD 14.2 billion. The more flexible instruments, interest rate options (percentageshare 8 %) and interest rate swaps (percentage share 84 %) show a particularly spectacular growth,whereas turnover in Forward Rate Agreements (FRAs) has remained virtually unchanged (table 4)."BR-Almost 90 % of the overall volume in interest rate swaps involves the euro (8 % involves USD and1 % GBP) and mainly concerns Eonia swaps. "The swift expansion of the Eonia swap market, onwhich Belgian institutions are quite active, is attributable among others to the flexibility and efficiencyof this hedging instrument.Interest rate options have been traded mostly in euro (84 % of the overall turnover), USD (8 %), DKK(3 %) and GBP (2 %)."There is nothing subtle here. This CB is switching to Euro's as rapidly as they can. Rather small CB compared to world average but looks closely tied to central government as most of their directors are heavy in banking AND governing experience. Not much diversity of backgrouns and education shows min. Master degrees mostly domestically educated. BR549 Netking (11/5/01; 11:15:42MT - usagold.com msg#: 64749) Summary of Fed "Temporary" Bank Reserves added since 911 http://www.321gold.com/fed/temp_bank_res.html Read & weep, unless you got gold (& silver). Inflation directly ahead . . . Full steam all engines Cap'n!- Netking Netking (11/5/01; 11:04:44MT - usagold.com msg#: 64748) Russia - Commercial banks accumulate 103 additional tons of Gold in 10 months http://www.russianstory.com/servlets/catalog/preview-frame?issue=004220011105000122&lang=en Good morning, I posted a link some time back of Russian gold reserves being up by 30.5 per cent since the beginning of the year, now we see commercial banks with 103 more tons of it . . . primitive country, primitive investments (grin)! - Netking jb (11/5/01; 10:15:14MT - usagold.com msg#: 64747) gold or money i wonder how much money geo.w.bush is putting into swiss bank accounts of the leader of tajikistan and other neigbouring countries so to use their country as a taking off place so they can kill more civilians in afg.if these leaders are smart they would be asking for gold and silver instead. USAGOLD (11/5/01; 08:55:31MT - usagold.com msg#: 64746) Today's Commentary http://www.usagold.com/Order_Form.html Ed. Note: Here we reproduce a portion of the Commentary & Review to give new visitors an idea of what goes on at our client-only page. Access is made available to prospective clients here with a free, one-time registration for access codes (link above). You'll also gain access to our News & Views: A Quarterly Review of Forecasts, Commentary and Analysis on the Economy and Precious Metals. 11/5/01 In Brief: Gold was down in early trading with a slightly stronger dollar playing the key role. Stocks are rallying on the prospect of another rate cut at tomorrow's Federal Reserve meeting, and that is also drawing attention away from the gold market for the moment. Traders report strong physical demand particularly from the Mid East and Pacific Rim, but the paper trade in London and New York was characterized as "quiet" and "rangebound." John Reade, analyst at UBS Warburg, told Reuters: "With the funds now net long only a small amount of gold...there is renewed potential for fresh speculative buying to take gold higher.'' A little perspective: While most assets tumbled following the chaotic events after September 11th, gold prices have bucked the trend showing a roughly 5% uptick from that date at the current $280 price and traded over the $290 level at one point. Stocks, bonds and saving vehicles have suffered from the dual onslaught of sliding values and the shrinking real rate of return on the dollar. Perceptions are changing. (More, go to link below) - - - - - - - Pandagold (11/5/01; 07:28:24MT - usagold.com msg#: 64745) Double posting I was surprised to see that last double post. When I realised I had clicked it twice, I immediately cancelled it by clicking shut the window before it had loaded.How it manages to post after being cancelled beats me.Any explanation from you computer nuts? WAC (Wide Awake Club) (11/5/01; 07:21:29MT - usagold.com msg#: 64744) Fix terrorism and the economy will boom and we can be rid of Flash G once and for all http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/uk_politics/newsid_1638000/1638878.stm Blair says economy needs terror defeatDefeating international terrorism is vital for economic stability and prosperity, Tony Blair is set to tell business leaders. In his keynote speech to the Confederation of British Industry annual conference, the prime minister will concede that the 11 September attacks on the United States have already "seriously affected" the world economy. These people are unbelievable. How about getting your economic house in order. How about stopping manipulations - be it Gold, Silver, Copper or any other commodities. How about paying developing nations a just price for their goods and services. Why don't the IMF bully boyz stop shafting the currencies of others. These and many others more are what is required. Stopping international terrorism is way, way down the list IMHO. Black Blade (11/5/01; 06:56:29MT - usagold.com msg#: 64743) Oil Tiptoes Up, OPEC Mulls Big Output Cut http://biz.yahoo.com/rb/011105/business_markets_oil_dc_1.html Snippit:SINGAPORE (Reuters) - Oil prices made small gains on Monday, extending a recovery from two-year lows, while OPEC signaled it may make deep cuts to world supplies in an attempt to revive the flagging market. Benchmark U.S. light crude rose 15 cents to $20.33 a barrel in Asia following Friday's 21-cent loss in New York, when crude briefly touched a low at $19.69, a level not seen since July 1999. OPEC Secretary-General Ali Rodriguez said on Monday the producers' cartel may consider a reduction in crude output of more than a widely-touted one million barrels per day (bpd) following last week's renewed slide in oil prices. Black Blade: Over 1 million bbl/day cut. "Interesting." Pandagold (11/5/01; 06:54:10MT - usagold.com msg#: 64742) Anthrax and Wall Street. I have been rather surprised (not really I haven't) that no anthrax has been found in Wall Street, stock exchange. Now, how could (why would) they have missed that? Pandagold (11/5/01; 06:53:35MT - usagold.com msg#: 64741) Anthrax and Wall Street. I have been rather surprised (not really I haven't) that no anthrax has been found in Wall Street, stock exchange. Now, how could (why would) they have missed that? Black Blade (11/5/01; 06:43:32MT - usagold.com msg#: 64740) Sept. 11 a scapegoat for ailing businesses? http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/businesstechnology/134362734_excuse05.html Snippit:What do Martha Stewart, Big Steel, automakers, Planet Hollywood, trendy clothing manufacturers, software companies and Scottish pubs have in common? Each is blaming poor financial performance on the recent terrorist attacks. To hear executives tell it, lagging attendance at the MGM film "Bandits," a dip in burger sales at Wendy's and fewer portabello-mushroom pizzas ordered at California Pizza Kitchen restaurants are explained by two words: Sept. 11. Not since the Persian Gulf War a decade ago has business latched onto a single uncontrollable event to account for lousy financial results. Airlines, hotels and the TV networks clearly were pummeled by fallout from the tragedy, but economists said other industries may be using the terrorist acts as cover for longstanding problems or as an excuse for job cuts. Black Blade: The terrorist attacks couldn't have come at a better time as the ghouls in corporate Board Rooms across America breathed a sigh of relief as Airliners crashed into the WTC and Pentagon. Now they had an excuse to cover-up miserable performance and falling profits. This is absurd of course, as we have been calling the recession long before the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks. This is quite convenient. Black Blade (11/5/01; 06:31:34MT - usagold.com msg#: 64739) Always look on the bright side of a severe recession http://www.smh.com.au/news/0111/05/biztech/biztech6.html Market optimists are refusing to give up, despite the horrific economic numbers published in the US last week. Snippit:It's the best of times for America's globally pace-setting sharemarkets and the worst of times for America and the world. But the bulls claim there isn't a contradiction. It's simply that the equity markets are looking through the present economic downturn to the better economic times that lie just ahead.They have deployed the same simplistic argument all year long as they tried to stem the bleeding in the sharemarket and succeeded in sparking rallies - but even the worst weeks in US and world economic history for a long, long time are failing to shake their story. Black Blade: Good article! Horrific data and yet the Pied Pipers continue to spin "Good Times Ahead." They are just churning commissions. This is going to get ugly when a sense of reality sets in. Again we hear that Mutual Funds have a strong net withdrawal of funds (again) last month. The title of the linked article is a good take off on Monty Pythons "Life of Brian" where at the end Eric Idle is crucified and sings - "Always Look on the Bright Side of Life." A lot of unsuspecting investors holding "for the long term" are about to be crucified, yet I suspect they won't be singing "Always Look on the Bright Side of Life." Black Blade (11/5/01; 06:16:35MT - usagold.com msg#: 64738) Warning of job loss 'tidal wave' http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/business/newsid_1636000/1636906.stm Snippit:In Geneva, a major conference on employment has ended with a warning that millions of people across the world face losing their jobs if action is not taken now to safeguard them. Winding up the three-day Global Forum on Employment, the International Labour Organisation (ILO) said the need to tackle an impending crisis in the global jobs market was now urgent. "The loss of nearly half a million jobs in the United States in the past month shows that the tidal wave has started to move and will end up on everyone's shores," said ILO vice president Bill Brett.Black Blade: The "Bone Pile" grows higher daily. Not likely to improve anytime soon. This is certainly not a good sign of a growing economy. In a word - "GRIM" Belgian (11/5/01; 05:57:31MT - usagold.com msg#: 64737) Contradictions US/ECB/BOE, calling for further IR declines (0,25%-0,5% -tuesday/thursday) and Ali Rodriguez, calling for rising crude prices (1 million barril cut), with POG, relatively unmoved, in between ! And some more (1,2 billion $) money for Pakistan.And the one and only virtual prosperity-positive, remains the US stockmarket, not willing to crash to earthlike valuations ! The last domino holding the dollar's hand. Pandagold (11/5/01; 05:55:13MT - usagold.com msg#: 64736) ChrisThompson Gold fields Chris Thompson 'Gold Fields' (mining web)"............The alternative interpretation you can put on it is that the 'store of value' function for gold has now gone. And I think the jury is still out on that issue. The Dow and all the markets are now perhaps more realistically appraising what the implications of September 11 are," Thompson said. He as also speaking on Classic Business.However, Thompson believes the outlook for the gold price is better than it has been for a while and adds that gold equities are still cheap compared with the cost of borrowing money. This makes special sense for Gold Fields's strategy. The company has announced two transactions to buy gold assets with a number of others in the wings.Thompson said the price of assets is such that his company could make a cash-on-cash return. Gold Fields has borrowed money today at Libor (London Interbank Offered Rate) plus 1 percent, which is a total of between 3.5 and 4 percent. This compares to gold assets which at current spot prices offer 10 to 15 percent rates of return, he said." Pandagold (11/5/01; 04:10:28MT - usagold.com msg#: 64735) Invisible Hand Could there be a Baron Panda de Rothschild?Hope you all digest some of the closing paragraphs of that article.Remember in many of my early posts when I used to get up some people's nostrils with my 'Try to see the BIG picture'?Stop (all) focusing on small details and stretch your minds until your head feels it will tear apart. It is IMPOSSIBLE to think big enough to see just what makes this world tick.Unless you really can conceive infinity, and the number of stars in the universe. The Invisible Hand (11/5/01; 03:48:54MT - usagold.com msg#: 64734) Pandagold Is there a Sir Douglas Rothschild aka FOA and TG? Pandagold (11/5/01; 03:27:16MT - usagold.com msg#: 64733) Gold and the House of Rothschild For anyone seriously interested in the GOLD market, you have to understand something about the name that is synonymous with the precious metal. Everyone has heard the name, but how much do you really know?Well, you will never know everything, for much is shrouded in secrecy. This is also why you will never know everything about the GOLD business.But, if you ever doubt the importance of GOLD throughout history, you won't after you become more acquainted with, at least, what we do know about this family whose influence touches ALL our lives.Here is just a little to wet your appetite( Taken from Marcus Angelicus Gold-Eagle)The English House of Rothschild (N.M. Rothschild & Sons)Of the two major Rothschild Houses (French and English), the London House (New Court ), founded by Nathan Mayer Rothschild and operating today as N.M. Rothschild and Sons, is undoubtedly the most influential, especially as it pertains to gold and currency trading. Twice daily a Rothschild agent sits in a cloistered room "fixing" the price of gold in the world's largest bullion trading market: the London Bullion Market Association ( LBMA ). Historically, N.M. Rothschild was owner and operator of England's Royal Mint Refinery and was the primary gold agent to the Bank of England.Nathan helped finance Britain's conquest of Napoleon at Waterloo, and benefited in London's stock market from advanced knowledge (from his superb courier service using pigeons) of Napoleons defeat at Waterloo. Nathan helped finance the Duke of Wellington's army having bought 800,000 pounds of gold from the East Indian Company for $8 million then selling the gold to the Duke to help defeat Napoleon. Hence, Nathan became chief broker and pay master general to England's most important army; the Rothschilds were England's lifeline for getting paycheques to the English army. Nathan could single handily wipe out savings of many a competitor by dumping "consols" in London driving down their share prices, as he did with the advance news of Napoleon's defeat. Nathan eventually switched businesses to "buying and selling money only."On a daily basis, Nathan was legendary in London's markets for jumping in and out of the market with tens of thousands of princely rounds, never too early and never too late. Eventually Nathan would become richer than Prince William, his father Mayer's German client. It is said that the Rothschilds were the inventors of the courier service using passenger pigeons to relay news amongst the family and to their client beneficiaries. Nathan's ability to depress stock prices, then buy them up after people panicked was legendary.. He would use Rothschild agents to send false news which would be used by observers falsely leading the crowd astray, then he would buy up the same stock at ridiculous low prices. One of the Rothschild's first victims was the legendary Barings and Ouvard Bank which Nathan almost destroyed after their competitor attempted to wrestle merchant banking business from the House. Ironically, Barings Bank recently suffered an untimely death at the hands of a rouge derivatives trader in Singapore!More than any other family, the Rothschilds have built and maintained an empire unparalleled by any monarchy in history. Their acumen as money changers and financier to the leaders of Europe over the past 200 years is unparalleled. No single corporation or business entity has survived with so much accumulated wealth intact.To this day, N.M. Rothschild & Sons of London still lists as its primary business the selling and buying of treasuries and gold bullion. N.M. Rothschild helps fix the price of gold in London each day through the LBMA. A recent London Times articles explained that the gold price fix ceremony where five men (including a Rothschild) talk on their phones for 10 minutes, then lower tiny Union Jacks sitting on their desks, thereby fixing London's gold price each day. This ceremony takes place at 10:30 a.m. and 3 p.m., like clockwork, the same way, in the same place, and with mostly the same firms participating since the first gold fixing was enacted at Rothschild in St. Swithin's Lane on Friday Sept. 12, 1919. The company's name is also associated with many gold mining companies (e.g. Trillion Resources Ltd. and other Canadian mining companies).The French House (Baron Edmond de Rothschild et.al.)The French House, which was most recently headed by the Baron Edmond de Rothschild, was the most powerful private merchanting banking arm and the richest of all the Rothschilds and ran the Compaigne Fincanciere, a world wide organization which builds villas, hotels, pipelines, and finances other banks. Rothschild Freres, run by cousing Baron Guy Eduoard, was the largest private bank in France. The French House also controlled mining companies ( De Beers and gold mines in South Africa ) , metal plants ( Rio Tinto ), oil interests ( Royal Dutch Shell ) , and chemical industries (Morton, 1962). The Baron was estimated to be the richest Rothschild and probably the most multiple millionaire/billionaire in Europe. That wealth is now passed on to his son, in Rothschild tradition always to the males, Benjamin ( 34 years of age ) . Edmonds cousin Baron Guy Eduoard was director of the Bank of France. Baron Guy, who owned the Compagnie du Nord railway network in France, was known to use participants to join in ventures serving as initiator and packager as well as guarantor with very deep pockets of cash.As Morton (1962) notes, the two banks in London and Paris are still probably the largest private institutions in the world. "Although the French house controls scores of industrial, commercial, mining, and tourist corporations, NOT ONE bears the family name." In the 1920s the banks of England and France were organized under the French House into a noisless international syndicate that reached from J.P. Morgan in New York to their cousin Baron Louis' Creditanstallt in Vienna, Austria.To appreciate the Rothschild's ability to sustain and increase their wealth and avoid the scrutiny of both the public, the markets, and the state taxation system, consider the story of the death of Edouard Rothschild, of the French House. Anticipating the death of Eduoard in 1949, Rothschild agents began to sell their majority stock holdings of Royal Dutch Shell, Rio Tinto and Le Nickel ( giant mining corporation ) to drive down the price of shares just prior to his death to reduce the value of the estate that was subject to taxation by the French Government. This selling created a panic in the world markets depressing stock prices further. A few days following the death of Eduoard, Rothschild agents bought the volume of stock back at depressed prices, and his reported estate wealth was taxed at the depressed price on the day of his death. One should never underestimate the capacity of a Rothschild to influence markets, even today.Rothschild interests touch virtually every aspect of our lives. They helped found and finance Royal Dutch Shell and De Beers. Following World War II they invested in vast areas of resource rich properties in Canada, possibly gold rich deposits. Joey Smallwood, premier of Newfoundland, Canada, described the 50,000 square mile land purchase by Rothschild as the biggest land deal in Canadian history. Their influence extends to the Bank of England, Bank of France and most likely the U.S. Federal Reserve, and possibly the IMF. They thus have enormous influence on the world's monetary policy.Accounting for the Rothschild Wealth and InfluenceMorton (1962) noted that the Rothschild wealth was estimated at over $6 billion US in 1850. Not a significant amount in today's dollars; however, consider the potential future value compounded over 147 years!Taking $6 billion (and assuming no erosion of the wealth base) and compounding that figure at various returns on investment (a conservative range of 4% to 8%) would suggest the following net worth of the Rothschild family enterprise:$1.9 trillion US (@ 4%)$7.8 trillion US (@ 5%)$31.5 trillion US (@ 6%)$125,189.1 trillion US (@ 7%)$491,409.0 trillion US (@ 8%) To give these figures some perspective consider these benchmarks: A little of $300 billion US buys every ounce of gold in every central bank in the world (see John Kutyn's estimate (http://www.gold-eagle.com/gold_digest/kutyn111597.html). U.S. M3 money supply August 1997 was $5.2 trillion U.S. debt is currently $5.4 trillion. U.S. GDP (1997; 2nd Q.) is $8.03 trillion. George Soros' empire is worth an estimated $20 billion. We shall never have a full accounting of their wealth. All we can go on is Morton's (1962) comment that their wealth is "ineffable as always." Even our conservative estimates suggest a family with staggering wealth and thus influence. In a world awash in debt and unsustainable fiat currencies subject to implosion, the power of gold and the preference of the Rothschilds to gold cannot be easily ignored.The Rothschilds and the LBMA: The World's Central Bank?Consider the Rothschild's profound position of influence in the LBMA and the transaction fees they are earning on each and every transaction of treasuries and 42 million ounces of gold transactions DAILY (recently reported volumes of physical, leased, forward sales). . The Rothschild business earns income from "transactions" (including transfers, calls, puts, trades, leases) and one can only begin to imagine the transaction costs associated with last reported trading of over 42 million ounces of gold per day through the LBMA (more than twice South Africa's annual gold production).Also consider their involvement and influence over monetary policies exercised by the Bank of England and the Bank of France (and possibly the US Federal Reserve System) and in Geneva. Consider the world's above ground gold reserves is roughly 120,000 tons -- with roughly 40,000 tons or 33% held by central banks. How is the remaining "private" gold holdings distributed? Does anyone have such an account? Certainly not the World Gold Council and their statistics. If a single private owner held 5% of world's remaining gold, would that not constitute majority share holdings? If any player could have accumulated, and could afford a 5% holding of the world's gold supply over the last 200 years, it would be the Rothschilds. Could it be that the Rothschilds through their involvement in daily London gold trades are quietly amassing more of the precious metals in their private vaults, while the confidence game of the Central Banks tries desperately to avoid what Soros calls "unsustainable" fiat currency built on unsustainable debt? It was Mayer Amschel Rothschild who kept a secret subterranean vault full of gold beneath the House of Rothschild in Frankfurt in the 1770s (Morton, 1962) .While the world is led to believe that gold is a barbaric relic of the past, a huge confidence game is being played out in fiat currency markets, illustrated by the events in Asia. In order to maintain confidence in inherently unsustainable fiat currencies and unsustainable debt, confidence in gold must be depressed, given that it is the only alternative store of value. The increasing volume of gold transacted through LBMA reflects the crescendo this confidence game has reached. These large volumes also suggest that gold is trading as currency and not as a barbaric commodity, as the press is apt to suggest. Could it be that the LBMA is being used as a testing ground for the establishment of a new gold-backed world currency system? If so, the Rothschilds are in a position of enormous influence over such a genesis process.Consider these words of Stanley Fisher (WSJ, Nov. 12, 1997), IMF's Deputy Managing Director: "What is needed at this point in the world's economic affairs is leadership in setting up a SYSTEM more dependable than using IMF bailouts as a guide to the future value of money. Where that leadership comes from is a tough question." Indeed, will the leadership and system Fisher is speaking come from the House of Rothschild through the central institution of the LBMA? Only time will tell.If the Rothschilds, through the LBMA operations, are effectively cornering the world's gold supply they would undoubtedly be in a prime position to benefit from a currency crisis - which they and Soros undoubtedly expect, given Soro's claims that the Asian, and thus by implication all fiat currencies, are inherently unsustainable. This crisis of sustainability is already engaged in Asia and will undoubtedly wash over Europe, England and the U.S. And who recently announced another bailout package? The IMF, of course. The Houses of Rothschild, more than any other players, knows the historical power of gold and importance of a gold-backed currency system. The English system they helped engineer remained resilient and sustainable for over 200 years until the early 1900s. The Rothschilds believe in gold as the ultimate store of value; always have and always will Undoubtedly they do not consider the metal a barbarous relic of the past.EpilogueWe are reminded of Morton's words, "today the family grooms the inaudibility and invisibility of its presence as a result, some believe that little is left apart from a great legend - and the Rothschilds are quite content to let legend be their public relations."What is unique about old power and money of the Rothschilds is their uncanny ability to sustain their power and wealth, and keep it within the family. While it is a tribute to the power of family, the danger is their ability to control and influence the daily lives of average human beings, with fewer resources and less power. Such power can lead to the temptation of becoming as powerful as the gods. Control over such important forms of value such as gold, as an instrument of liberty, may lead to the temptation of exercising dominion over such liberty. The maintenance of power and wealth is ultimately motivated by an anxiety of losing the security that such power has provided. The power and wealth of the Rothschilds carries with it enormous privileges and hopefully a sense of responsibility for the welfare of others. While the Rothschilds and Rockefellers have exercised philanthropy to the benefit of many, even this exercise has benefited their corporations through a tax system which rewards such "charitable" and "atruistic" organisations. What distinguishes the Rothschilds from other world power brokers, like Soros, is their diminutive "presence" in the world, in spite of their untold influence on almost every aspect of our economic existence. Their continued bullishness on gold exhibited through their activities in the LBMA and gold trading suggests that we maintain our confidence in the this barbaric relic. Ultimately, however, one must be keenly aware of the potential controlling influence over gold which the Rothschilds and their merchant banking brethren can exercise, and thus placing our liberty in their hands.It has been said that "the wealth of Rothschild consists of the bankruptcy of nations" References:The Globe and Mail (various issues)The Wall Street JournalMorton, Frederic (1962). The Rothschilds.Corti, Baron Egon Caesar (1928). The Rise of the House of Rothschild.Soros, George (1994). The Alchemy of Finance Belgian (11/5/01; 03:20:57MT - usagold.com msg#: 64732) Auspec / CBs A few years ago, the question was raised, what would happen to the public shareholding of the Belgian National Bank, when it should be fully integrated into ECB ? How should the shareholding be liquidated ? Again, no sign of any answer to that. On your question, who is behind the CBs, is the government as policy-maker and guardian of the confidence/trust in fiat.CB-policies are a matter of National (?) interest as is state security. The only democratic grip on it is that it is the elected government who decides on the policies, with a minimum of transparance. The governor of the belgian CB has been the same person for almost live. Political proxy of the biggest political party. Today, he has been followed up by a family member (nepotism). Evidence of the top secret atmosphere that surrounds it. No way to find out what they are really up to. Only left with dry announcements of what happened, POST FACTUM ! (cfr. goldsales or fiat devaluations)And with this, we land again on the -political- will terrain.Currency strenght/weakness in function of what ? And this is a matter of pure policy and power relations, above the heads of the ones we think, that are in charge of these CBs.The more that trust or distrust in fiat is a matter in the welbeing of a prosperous economy, the less we will detect on future policies. As soon as dollar-strength becomes counterproductive in globo, things will change dramatically.And it is this fiat history that we (Goldadvocates) suppose/believe, is to run on its last legs. No matter who owns or controls the CBs. Interest rates and fiat purchasing power, can go to zero, as can the amount of Gold in the vaults. But Gold valuation can never reach that same zero. It is as essential as oxygen , water and food. Zenidea (11/5/01; 02:15:26MT - usagold.com msg#: 64731) Le Metropole Cafe Golden Boardrooms. FOA; do you think that there is any substance to this brother ?. Spartacus (11/5/01; 02:01:07MT - usagold.com msg#: 64730) After 200-Plus Years, Coin Would Be Eliminated in Bill http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?pagename=article&node=&contentId=A33617-2001Sep2 Rep. Jim Kolbe (R-Ariz.) is lending a hand to lighten the load of Americans weighed down by spare change. He wants to eliminate the penny."The penny is a hassle and has outlived its usefulness," Kolbe said. "I want to make it more convenient for Americans."The bill is headed to the House Financial Services Committee's subcommittee on domestic monetary policy, technology and economic growth. Spartacus (11/5/01; 01:43:37MT - usagold.com msg#: 64729) Treasury's Action on Long-Term Bonds http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nyt/20011101/bs/wall_street_stunned_by_treasury_s_action_on_long-term_bonds_1.html Wall Street Stunned by Treasury's Action on Long-Term Bonds. Traders viewed the Treasury Department's decision to halt the issuance of 30-year bonds as an almost desperate effort to push down long-term interest rates. Belgian (11/5/01; 01:12:44MT - usagold.com msg#: 64728) @ Auspec The Nationale Bank van Belgie : Partly owned by the public, through shareholding, as listed on the Brussel's stock exchange. The (SM) valuation of the National Bank, never exceeds its estimated bookvalue. Price fluctuations are in line with its dividend and general interest rates. A dull but reliable shareholding.At the first shock of Belgian's (supposed) Goldsales (400 tonnes-somewhere in '96-320$/ounce - ?? ), the public (private-shareholders), raised hopes on a gigantic windfall, increased valuation or a super-dividend ! Nothing happened. The answer was simply, that the revenue from the Goldsale(s) would be used to comply for EMU participance, due to the debt situation of 120% of GDP.There were no questions (allowed) in parlement and that was it. Recently, some (chocolat) Gold fanatics, tried again to mobilize a parlementarian for questionning about the Belgian Gold treasure (once-1.300 tonnes for a mini country)Absolute silence with the usual blablablah! As soon as you mention *Gold*, in relation with the nationale bank...all communication is interrupted. So my answer is very simple and disappointing : I know nothing about the "why and how" of the relative big Goldstash that was before.I do remember that a fistfull of Nationale Bank shareholders (private) adressed "Deminor", to take up their defense in the Goldsale-dispute. Deminor is a Belgian/French organization that is specialized in the defense of public shareholders in disputes. And if I'm not mistaken, Reg Howe is also using their services in the BIS case. I concluded that nothing could be done and no information will ever be available (for us little fish) on this whole Gold-sale-transfer-EMU-swap-etc....Top secret, and that's it.Indirectly, it might be some strong indication that TG's theories are in the work out phase, after all these years, and that it all is WA -related. Since I'm totally non-political, It is impossible to gather more inside information on the *very important* topic.Democraty...shhhhhiaahhh ? Netking (11/5/01; 00:39:02MT - usagold.com msg#: 64727) Full Steam Ahead for the USS "Inflation" http://www.321gold.com/editorials/saville/110501/saville110501.html From Mr Steve Saville of The Speculative Investor 5 November, 2001.Snippet:Our forecast for the next 12-18 months is that the high rate of inflation (money supply growth) over the past 12 months will boost prices and that commodities will be the major beneficiaries of the inflation. As is usually the case when commodity prices are pushed higher by inflation, bonds will not fare well. . . " Netking (11/5/01; 00:35:31MT - usagold.com msg#: 64726) Gold conspiracy's Gordian knot (Good Luck Reg.) http://m1.mny.co.za/MGGold.nsf/Current/4225685F0043D1B285256AF90011B7C6 Snippet from Mining Web on "The Case";Greek mythology tells us that everything Midas touched turned to gold. How fitting that his father was Gordius, the peasant king of Phrygia. He gave us the Gordian knot and Reg Howe will try to untie one on Monday when he leads argument in his impudent case against an alleged gold cabal in Federal Court in Boston. . . .The whole business of the conspiracy could be staged as a drama. Gold Anti-Trust Action Committee chairman Bill Murphy is a natural Midas; everything he touches turns to publicity. The "gold cabal" could play Apollo who furiously planted donkey ears on Midas for disapproving of the god's music. Wouldn't they just love to kick that ass…? Reg Howe, swashbuckling plaintiff, is a natural Alexander the Great.Murphy could also be cast as Gordius. He has succeeded in knotting the knot. At least Gordius's knot was made of bark; Murphy's is a ball of superfine fishing line. In many ways, Midas Murphy seems to need the conspiracy even as he curses it. But he is an effective and loyal scabbard bearer for Alexander-Howe.As Howe strides to the bench clasping his sword he risks transforming into a subject of Gordius. To prove his assertions he must abide by the judicial familiarity with Gordius's linear thinking that rules out drawing a sword. Instead, he must rely on his elaborate deconstruction of the knot. If all goes to plan, then it will not be Howe untying the knot, but his opponents who unwittingly tug on a slipknot that he has prepared to reveal a theft of Promethean proportions . . . . Good luck Reg.------------------------------------------------------------You missed out in the Mining Web story line Chris Powell as did our local girl Xena! . . . but we all hope that against TPTB that this impasse is broken open and that the truth is revealed for all. We know that sooner or later this will be the case. Good luck Mr Howe & team. - Netking ViewYesterday's Discussion.
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