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Welcome to the USAGOLD Gold Discussion Archives. The archives of this gold discussion forum are a treasure trove of information to educate investors about protecting their wealth through portfolio diversification with private gold ownership. The discussion forum also covers the wider issues of the past, present, and future role of gold in international monetary policy and the dynamics of the modern gold markets...

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Archives date back to September 22, 1998

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ARCHIVED DISCUSSION FROM 9/30/1999
All times are U.S. Mountain Time

View Yesterday's Discussion.

TownCrier (09/30/99; 23:06:53MDT - Msg ID:15050)
Good question, Goldfly
"By what date does delivery have to occur?"

I'm not sure of the deadline following a notice of intention for delivery. Maybe one of our experienced commodities traders who have been through this or looked into it can come out of the woodwork to provide an answer.

TownCrier (09/30/99; 22:59:05MDT - Msg ID:15049)
A supplemental GOLDEN VIEW---Part II---it didn't all transmit
...faces a tough review by US lawmakers.

The Gold Institute said that recent actions of the International Monetary Fund, and the agreement to limit gold sales and lending by a European group of central bankers triggered a "fundamental change" in the gold market. That seems to be the prevailing sentiment, now, doesn't it? Although you'd never know it from Financier George Soros. The Big Cheese was questioned about the outlook for gold prices following meeting with the front-running Chilean presidential candidate, Ricardo Lagos, at a lunch Lagos had today with several members of New York's financial community. Soros declined to comment. Read into that what you will.

And finally we have this from Bridge news, giving the low-down on this current period of "sorting out" we mentioned following the havoc wrought in recent days...
GOLD MARKET PLAYERS RECONSIDER HEDGING PROGRAMS
London--Sep 30-- Gold market players are deciding whether or not to cut
their losses and cover their short positions as the market hovers around
US $300 per ounce, sources told Bridge News. This is prolonging the volatility
in the spot market, traders and analysts added.
***
Reprinted at USAGOLD with permission. For details please go to:
http://www.crbindex.com/reviews/index.htm
No further reproduction without written permission

And that's the second glance from the rooftop.

TownCrier (09/30/99; 22:56:43MDT - Msg ID:15048)
A supplemental GOLDEN VIEW
The New York Mercantile Exchange received complaints from customers unable to get their gold option orders executed on the COMEX division this week. Looks like obtaining paper gold isn't a sure thing in this market, either. Let's be safe out there, people.

The decision today by the Central Bank of Russia (CBR) to increase the discount on prices it pays for gold purchased domestically (from 2% to 5.5% below the morning London fixing starting Friday) explains why lease rates may have temporarily(?) eased slightly off of yesterday's highs. With export taxes at 5% on gold, for those needing cash it is now more favorable for Russian banks and producers to export gold than to sell it to the CBR. If lease rates stay high, Russian gold may seek the profits to be found on deposit at bullion banks such as those within the LBMA. And so it moves...from weak hands into strong ones.

Here's an exact quote from Bridge news:
Washington--Sep 30--The International Monetary Fund today said it gave
official approval to a plan to revalue up to 14 million ounces of gold, through
off-market sales to member central banks. Money gained from the transaction will
pay for an expanded program of debt relief for poor countries. ---------
Again, we must wonder if the reporter got this right or not. It would appear as written that the gold is not going to be returned to the IMF. It makes us wonder if Japan knew what they were talking about days ago when an official suggested that they would buy whatever the IMF had to offer.

Despite this "official IMF approval," it ain't over 'til it's over. One of the biggest congressional critics of the International Monetary Fund has been US Rep James Saxton. Of this new gold-revaluation and debt-relief plan Congressman Saxon said it still faces a tough review by US lawmakers.

The Gold Institute said that recent actions of the

Goldfly (09/30/99; 22:31:39MDT - Msg ID:15047)
Town Crier

Thanks for the clarification. You've probably said the like before and I didn't pick it up...

Soooooo.... By what date does delivery have to occur? Next month? Is that why we're hearing people saying November should bring fireworks?

Or maybe just fire?

Black Blade (09/30/99; 22:07:44MDT - Msg ID:15046)
novice
I understand that there is a dealership in SA that markets a car with side mounted flamethrowers to deter and fry wouldbe carjackers. Talk about driving defensibly!

novice (09/30/99; 21:57:07MDT - Msg ID:15045)
South Africa
South Africa, mainly Johannesburg, is the murder capital of the world. Anyone who chooses to carry a gun does.
I personally don't think the attempt was a random attack, but thieves there, would shoot anyone for any reason. It is a horrible place.

Golden Calf (09/30/99; 21:25:27MDT - Msg ID:15044)
Something to think about---(decisions)
From the looks of the longer term charts, including
the XAU index, the likelyhood of an upmove in the
precious metals into the spring of y2k is likely.

This having been said, if one has their holding in
a bank, or even with a broker, and the potential problems
of y2k or financial upheavals, should occur one may never
see those gains.....What to do?

Bonedaddy (09/30/99; 21:22:38MDT - Msg ID:15043)
Did anyone catch the news tonight?
last day of September ('99)

Mexico's shaking,
Markets are quaking,
And people just going their way.
In Japan men are glowing,
In Queens no ones knowing
Who the vermin will infect today.
They say paper is money
And though its not funny,
They're laughing as they turn away.
I can't help but feeling
That the whole world is reeling,
While Jesse at Gov'nor will play.
Our leaders are weakened,
Our government's creakin',
But our wise men can't have a say.
You see, it's a new generation
And it's filled with temptation,
To have things exactly our way.
But let's not be forgettin'
On a tightrope we're sittin'
And I think it's beginning to sway.

--Bonedaddy--

RossL (09/30/99; 21:20:35MDT - Msg ID:15042)
e-gold
https://www.e-gold.com/newacct/newaccount.asp?cid=100339
I looked at it a couple years ago when they started. They have a great web page. Accounts are free, so I opened one, but I haven't used it. They are trying to come up with a new digital money that is encrypted and anonymous. The money transfers title to an amount of gold.

TownCrier (09/30/99; 21:13:30MDT - Msg ID:15041)
Hear ye! Hear ye! There is an update at USAGOLD
http://www.usagold.com/wgc.html
THIS WEEK IN GOLD has now been updated with the latest gold market commentary by World Gold Council staff. Described therein is a recounting of the UK auction and the subsequent events of the week September 20-24 which led up to this weekend's announcement of the European central banks...touching off the sharply higher prices of this week, and realigning the stars on a fundamentally new gold market that is not as it was just a few days ago.

(disregard their comments on the scaling factor...it's of no significance)

NewGold (09/30/99; 21:07:40MDT - Msg ID:15040)
USA GOLD, Leigh ,Cavan Man
I was thinking of buying South African Gold shares
that are being talked about in other Gold sites, but I've changed my mind tonight, I think I'll look at some other Gold shares. What I know about this situation comes from
reading jinx44, at that other Gold site, He is a former South African who also fled because of the new marxist ANC
President who is appointing his marxists friends to almot
all key Gov. positions, replacing most whites, and he
also said that Russia would have a lot of pull in South African affairs.

I must qualify this by saying that I do not know this jinx44
but he seemed pretty passsionate and knowledgeable about what he called the sell out by the whites to the marxists ANC, as the reason these marxists appointments are taking place.

He also mentioned the terrible violent crime there, but
I was referring to the shooting of a high Parliament
Official, and wether that was "normal" for South Africa.

Chris Powell (09/30/99; 20:56:53MDT - Msg ID:15039)
What the European central banks really did
http://www.egroups.com/group/gata/217.html?
GATA Vice Chairman and
Treasurer John Meyer
explains it better
than anyone else.

http://www.egroups.com/group/gata/217.html?

nugget101 (09/30/99; 20:55:15MDT - Msg ID:15038)
E-Gold
Has anyone had any experience with this?
It looks good to me because I don't have to worry about theft of my physical, I can redeem in any governmental currency and therefore protect myself if the dollar tanks, I can specify any PM, and it is electronically payable.
I'm getting a little paranoid about having so much PM in the house. I don't want it in a bank, and I don't trust the gov to not take it if they want. I don't want to bury it or hide it too well because if I am killed then my relatives might not be able to take advantage of it.
Comments?

Cavan Man (09/30/99; 20:33:43MDT - Msg ID:15037)
Thumbs Up
Has anyone had a good experience with The Sovereign Society?

Cavan Man (09/30/99; 20:32:14MDT - Msg ID:15036)
watcher
The US must be restructured but not foreclosed upon. I agree and also believe the process will take time.

Cavan Man (09/30/99; 20:28:43MDT - Msg ID:15035)
NewGold
Last week I was in New Orleans and met an Irish Exec. visiting for a trade show. This man has lived in many countries including SA. He told me he left the company that employed him in SA because he feared for his life and the safety of his family. He said that violence there was endemic and unimaginable.

TownCrier (09/30/99; 20:28:13MDT - Msg ID:15034)
After the Close: the GOLDEN VIEW from The Tower
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/990930/21.html
In our featured link today, Chicago Federal Reserve Bank President Michael Moskow said in a Chicago Fed and Bank for International Settlements conference, "We have learned that no one country is immune to financial crisis." The topic was lessons learned from the recent financial crisis that swept the globe. Problems spread more quickly across borders with the growing interdependence of the world economy, as evidenced by the three rapid rate cuts by the Fed when U.S. credit markets seized up in the fall of 1988 on the heels of the Asian and Russian turmoil. (According to other reports read here at The Tower, few Americans have any inkling how dangerously close we came to complete collapse at that time.) That was the real sobering wake-up call that something had to be done. In this Reuters report, Mr. Moskow indicates that better international cooperation among central banks and regulators is the necessary cure against financial contagion...increasing the importance of the BIS and its role among them. Just another piece of the big picture.

This being the last trading day of the third quarter, today's gains on heavy volume in the stock market are attributable to portfolio adjustments as fund managers with large cash positions due to the current market downdraft are often obligated to establish investment ratios specified by their various funds. Window dressing also occurs as they plow money into their biggest positions to further pump up the end-of-quarter numbers that go "into the history books." In light of this mentality, we find it remarkable that, despite gold's huge gains in the past week-and-a-half, it wasn't absolutely sold into the graveyard today by long holders wanting to lock in some cash gains. However, with the dollar in a downward slide, as a wise one at this Table once said, (although in a different context) "would you cut your winners and let your losers run?"

So while the DOW finished up 123.47 today (with new 52-week lows still outnumbering new highs 211 to 55) you would do well to recognize that for the quarter, the DOW lost 634 points (5.8 percent.)

Month-end and quarter-end trading was also said to be a source of support for 30-Yr Bond prices as well as for stocks, in addition to the normal correction to be expected after a series of losses as driven by technical traders. Traders also referred to the nuclear accident in Japan, which was credited for pushing the dollar higher against earlier losses vs the yen, and news of an earthquake in Mexico as creating enough jitters to fuel some buying. The yield today fell to 6.056%.

In the currency world, the dollar posted losses against both the yen and the euro, falling by 0.64 yen from the previous close, and giving up 0.51 cents against the euro.

Traders are still reacting to the havoc caused to positions by the sharp increases in gold's price, and the market seems to have briefly paused while they sort this out and assess the various lumps. Spot settled below $300 at $297.70 as trading in NY closed. Gold lease rates eased, but still remain more "expensive" than borrowing dollars, or more lucrative for lenders...IF you can trust ever seeing your gold again. Here's how they currently stand:

1-month 6.9000% -2.0000
2-month 6.4710% -0.9978
3-month 7.0830% -0.4950
6-month 5.4610% -0.9970
12-mnth 5.0350% -1.9950

We'll now look in on Bridge News to see what the traders had to say about today's dealings...
NY Precious Metals Review: Gold, PGMs down on profit-taking
By Darcy Keith and Tina Petersen, Bridge News
Washington--Sep 30--
Traders said the losses in Dec gold, which settled down $2.50 at
$299.5 per ounce, encouraged the selling of the platinum group metals.
Dec gold saw a continuation of Wednesday's retracement and has begun a
consolidation mode. "We're seeing gold retrace, but it's all on
profit-taking and technical moves by the funds," said a trader. "A lot of
people had thrown their cash at the market this week and now they're
taking their cash and running. This is adding a lot of volatility to the
market."

A few traders said they expect another day or 2 of consolidation but
see gold having the potential to reach $310-320 again in the near term.
"We might see some small breaks to test where the downside support is, but
we should still see good buying," said a trader.

Vanessa Motto, analyst with CPM Group, said that the volatility in gold could
last for another 10 days or so, and added that initial support is at $300
followed by $288 and $280.
"Everyone is sitting back waiting for another move to be made," said a
trader. "No one's taking a significant position."***
(c) Copyright 1999 FWN Reprinted at USAGOLD with permission. For details please go to:
http://www.futuresource.com/internet.shtml
No further reproduction without written permission from FWN.
---
Well, they may not be taking a significant new position in the paper that Ms Motto watches, but they are taking the gold. We turn now to our continuing saga of substantial futures postions being exchanged for physical positons.
+
Out of total open interest of 211,821, the open interest in the COMEX October futures stood at 2,114 contracts as the day began today. With this being First Notice Day for delivery intentions on these October contracts, 1,483 were called for delivery as we announced earlier today. That's 148,300 ounces. Delivery intentions in quantity is where the pricing of paper suddenly meets the real world. We wonder how many of the short siders will opt out and pass the buck by buying another contract and calling for delivery. Significant positions were taken by The Bank of Nova Scotia (774 contracts), Morgan Stanley (485), and Salomon Smith Barney (109). Elsewhere in the real world, 14,226 ounces of Registered gold was removed from COMEX's ScotiaMocatta depository. Total COMEX gold stock now stands at 928,005 ounces.

And finally, lackluster trade ruled the scene at NYMEX trading of energy futures on the lack of fresh news. November crude settled down 18c at $24.51, with traders expecting a Friday rally to test $25.

And that's the view from here...after the close.

Leigh (09/30/99; 20:20:00MDT - Msg ID:15033)
A Little Tidbit from Gold-Eagle
Here's a bit of news from (buz) at Gold-Eagle:
"A judge ruled that four different individuals with at least 5 million in assets, must be found to provide bail for Armstrong, or he will go back to the slammer. Prosecutors fear he will flee!"

USAGOLD (09/30/99; 20:11:54MDT - Msg ID:15032)
I should have said, thank God,
assination attempt............

USAGOLD (09/30/99; 20:09:43MDT - Msg ID:15031)
To the South African meisters...On the Assasination
If we have a South African goldmeister who can explain to us the significance of this horrible event, all of us at this Table would be greatly served.

watcher (09/30/99; 20:07:07MDT - Msg ID:15030)
ORO and all
Oro, I have to agree with you on possible outcome of the currency inflation and drawn out inflation in the USA ,instead of total collapse,even though that is still possible.
An old mentor and past employer sometime back shared this with me once, " If someone owes you a little money their your friend, if they owe you a lot of money they are your partner"
The US has a lot of partners and probabably why this thing will unwind over a long time in what will be fits and starts that will be hard to follow and maybe hard to trade
Even the mob won't go out and shoot the person who owes them money. They may cause him a lot of stress along the way though. The debtor is slave to the lender and default is worse for both.
Great gold market all !!!

The train is pulling up to the first station stop. Several cars are full of nervous looking people. Someone leans over at a bench in the station house and whispers to Another person seated beside him " Goldbugs in those cars,watch some of them give up their ticket on that gold train their on. They been on that train for a long time and it just got to this first station. They are worried that the train is going to get stuck again and they selling the ticket back to the Trainmaster. Look down there and he points to the conductor selling their tickets to some very well dresed people coming from New York city.Whenever those guys are getting on the train I hear the train does real well and it just keeps on going and going and.......

Leigh (09/30/99; 20:06:57MDT - Msg ID:15029)
NewGold
Did anyone notice that Mr. Nkosi was carrying a gun and returned fire on his assailants -- and they FLED? That gun saved his life!

NewGold (09/30/99; 20:04:22MDT - Msg ID:15028)
More than just a Theft in South Africa, another view
http://www.iol.co.za/news/newsview.php3?click_id=79&art_id=ct19990930215217254N200500&set_id=1
It seems that this was an attempted assassination of the
South African Minerals Chair. I wonder why him?
is this sort of thing "normal" down there?

Chris Powell (09/30/99; 19:47:43MDT - Msg ID:15027)
What the European central banks really mean
http://www.egroups.com/group/gata/217.html?
GATA Vice Chairman and Treasurer
John D. Meyer explains it as no
one else has.

http://www.egroups.com/group/gata/217.html?

NewGold (09/30/99; 19:37:12MDT - Msg ID:15026)
BIG trouble in South Africa
http://www.iol.co.za/news/newsview.php3?click_id=13&art_id=qw938714340334N220&set_id=1
The ANC Chair of Minerals was shot 6 times in an
asasination attempt. I wonder if this is connected to
the nationalization of South African mines by the ANC
I read here yeterday.

Leigh (09/30/99; 19:29:58MDT - Msg ID:15025)
CoBra(too)/WAC
Hi, CoBra! After you mentioned being a member of lemetropolecafe.com, I went over to check it out and decided to try out a trial membership. The articles are very interesting! I'll be sending GATA my money for a subscription this weekend. See what a shining example you have set!!

WAC - did your gold order ever come in? Was there really a meeting to consider ending gold sales to customers?

TownCrier (09/30/99; 18:47:56MDT - Msg ID:15024)
Gold's Surge Wreaks Havoc on Wall Street Inflation Models
http://www.thestreet.com/markets/marketfeatures/789050.html
"...showed the extent to which central-bank selling has influenced gold's price, further discrediting its use as an indicator..."

Not your typical media trashing of gold. They trash it as an inflation indicator, but they don't mock it as a financial asset. If you think about it, using price of gold as an inflation indicator for the U.S. is not much different than looking at the price of yen or euros as an inflation indicator. If the dollar exchange rate is dropping against any of them, you might conclude that the that the dollar was losing strength (from inflation?), or you could conclude that the other currency was gaining strength. You simply have to look at the whole picture.

SteveH (09/30/99; 18:47:14MDT - Msg ID:15023)
repost
www.gold-eagle.com
this from above link:

Bottom line: Russia cannot become a golden party-pooper. BS!
(goArmy) Sep 30, 18:05

London--Sep 30--Gold market players are deciding whether to cut their losses and cover their short positions as the market hovers around $300 per ounce. This is prolonging the volatility in the spot market, traders and analysts said.

Moscow--Sep 30--The Central Bank of Russia will increase the discount for its purchases of gold on the domestic market to 5.5% from the morning London fixing starting Friday, making it less profitable for Russian banks to sell gold to the central bank. The increase from the current 2.0% aims at boosting Russian gold exports, a senior bank official said. By Sergei Padalko and Oleg Kirsanov.

From MIDAS

"A representative of the Central Bank of Russia told Bridge News that it is possible the CBR may place 7.3 million ounces of its gold with western banks, thereby enabling it to be lent to the market. He said that due to the current 5 percent export tax on precious metals, it was not profitable for the CBR to sell gold outright, but that added lending it out was possible, depending on the interest rates offered by the banks concerned. "While the climb in gold lease rates makes it more attractive to lend gold, they are probably not yet sufficiently high to cancel out Russia's 5 percent export tax on precious metals, said traders. Also, Leonard Kaplan, chief bullion dealer at LFG Bullion Services, said that the Russian Central Bank is not a very large holder of gold and even if they were to lend, it 'wouldn't make a dent in this market."

Conclusion: Russia cannot become a golden party-pooper. Big BS. Don't worry

CoBra(too) (09/30/99; 18:24:28MDT - Msg ID:15022)
@Leigh
Dear Leigh,
You're such a delight to this forum (and please forgive me for not yet coming to terms with the "sound of music" post - it'll come with time)and btw congratulations on your well deserved laureat status. Time seems evermore to be of essence (what a dreadful legal term).

I feel Bill Murphy, even if I don't subscribe to all and everything he's got to say, is a very powerful and daring man of clear convictions and visions. I've never regretted to be an early member of the cafe, nor a contributor to GATA (however small), but I feel spreading his ideas - as I humbly try - is even more rewarding.
A golden night to you Leigh and all CB2

Leigh (09/30/99; 17:55:50MDT - Msg ID:15021)
CoBra(too)
http://www.gold-eagle.com/editorials_99/taylor100199.html
Dear CoBra: What a generous gesture! I read the above interview with Bill Murphy this morning and was so impressed with him and his cause. He is putting everything on the line for the cause of gold. He truly deserves our support.

CoBra(too) (09/30/99; 17:34:56MDT - Msg ID:15020)
@MK-USAGOLD
Dear MK, ws just going through some of my "ancient" treasure of coins and came up with 2 one dollar silver eagles dated 1880 and 1885, respectively (not in mint condition, but not too bad).

If they are of any numismatic value, I would like to forward them to our cause at GATA (my former 200 $ seem inadequate)- pls advise!

Thank you CB2

Leigh (09/30/99; 16:58:02MDT - Msg ID:15019)
USAGOLD
Dear Michael: Today I received my 1/2-ounce Gold Eagle and congratulatory letter. Thank you so, so much for sponsoring the contest and selecting my essay! The Eagle will be a prize that "keeps on giving" as the value goes up! Though -- how could I ever part with it? Thank you again.

granny (09/30/99; 16:57:42MDT - Msg ID:15018)
TownCrier
Ye are welcome, sir. I'll give MK a jingle. What is the best way of going about this task?
Be well, granny

Hipplebeck (09/30/99; 16:51:52MDT - Msg ID:15017)
(No Subject)
Poor Andy
He's whimpering as though he is short
Maybe he is

granny (09/30/99; 16:45:56MDT - Msg ID:15016)
Leigh
Thanks Leigh,

Yes, I've noticed the urgency and it is contagious, if one is observant enough. I, too, feel the urgency.

By collecting, I mean I have mostly gold eagles, in hand(don't know how much to disclose other than a family of 4 could live quite nicely off of its current value or even face value ..)for some weeks. I will use it, if necessary, for survival, and that is really the main reason I have it (and they sure are pretty).

We have been preparing, both personal and business, for potential small to catastrophic disruptions in the coming months. We do not want to leave out monetary considerations. So we (hubby and I) have pooled our liquid assests (mostly cash) and want to "do something with it" "right now"!! Is that urgent enough? :D

Specifically, I had in mind purchase of something that would be probably liquid or usable, if monetary structure is near totally trashed or trashed by Y2K disruptions.

What should I buy right now, in coins, bullion, bars, etc., that could potentially survive a world monetary crash; something that would/could be exchangable for goods or services. I'm trying to protect assests AND have something that can be (realitivly easily) converted to "money" in the next few months, to next few years, if that becomes necessary. I would be willing to "take a hit"(loss), for survival/comfort purposes if that became necessary.

Am I living in a dream world? Is it too late? Help and thanks.
granny
PS.. Having a large herd of giant dogs ... need I say more .. I've always claimed "my jewelry is furry and walking on four legs" the rest is pretty coins or in my teeth.

TownCrier (09/30/99; 16:39:23MDT - Msg ID:15015)
Greece Wary of Y2K Problems
http://cnnfntech.newsreal.com/apnews/19990929/03/53/6022129_st.html
With only thirteen weeks left, the government wants to declare Dec. 31 a bank holiday to deal with any Y2K problems, joining steps taken by other countries and its European Union partners.

TownCrier (09/30/99; 16:23:27MDT - Msg ID:15014)
Nice to have you with us, M'lady granny
You've done your reading...you probably already know what answer you want to hear. If you want to talk about various concerns, it's been our experience that MK will lend an ear and offer some rational advice. Just give him a jingle, he might have some ideas you haven't even thought of yet.

Leigh (09/30/99; 16:16:45MDT - Msg ID:15013)
granny
Dear granny: Thank you for writing in. Would you mind being more specific? You've been collecting "coins?" Do you mean rare coins, or gold bullion, or do you simply mean you've been saving money? You have $20-30K to put into precious metals (perhaps)? Well, our host, Michael Kosares at Centennial Precious Metals, can advise you if you call or e-mail him.

Have you been reading the Forum for very long? You may have noticed an increased sense of urgency this week. We feel that gold is becoming quite scarce and may be very difficult to find at reasonable prices soon. You are right to be anxious!

We hope you'll write in again. Good luck with your investments!

TownCrier (09/30/99; 16:14:02MDT - Msg ID:15012)
Tea leaves: IMM currency futures mostly higher, yen up but off highs
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/990930/bbe.html
Dollar is down against nearly everything, traders expect the yen to keep climbing.

TownCrier (09/30/99; 15:55:12MDT - Msg ID:15011)
IMF crisis plan falters
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/business/the_economy/newsid_461000/461813.stm
So why hasn't the gold market folded yet if it is on such thin ice?

This comment regarding Ecuador's default on debt repayment is taken out of context, but it applies just as well here: Ecuador's foreign minister, Benjamin Ortiz, warned creditors that in "worsening the situation for Ecuador they are worsening their own situation." As long as it can be held together, there is hope that their exiting position may be made incrementally better.

Keep in mind that the international banks are not completely united...Germany's Deutschebank has accused reform proposals so far of favoring US banks over their European rivals, saying that US banks get information about possible defaults earlier than those without good contacts in Washington.

The BBC offers this last word about the IMF's future: "without agreement on the causes and cures for any future crisis, the IMF itself may be one of the most vulnerable parts of the world financial system."

granny (09/30/99; 15:38:09MDT - Msg ID:15010)
Need advice ... oh boy ...
Howdy all. This is my first post.

Yes, I am female and soon to be a granny. Looking for advice please. (I guess we'll all know I'm asking it for my self.)

Suppose one has been collecting "coins" for some time, being old fashioned and wanting to protect some assests, and then one finds oneself in a position to protect a larger sum of cash than before AND one is not necessarily looking to "make a killing" but, also, not wanting to poo-pah profit (hey, this person isn't that old ... a true capitalist by raising.)....

With what is going on in the precious metal's world, and trying to understand, somewhat, what is happening right now what should one do with $20K to $30K??? Said person would love to sit on money for a long time but with Y2K and so much potential monetary disruption possible one may need to disperse funds to employee's, and other's who might otherwise expect or need funds. "One" feels really uneasy about "regular" investing, banking, and "cash" at this point in time.

It looks like, with each passing day, go*d, in particular, might become harder and harder to get "in hand". Therefore, "one" feels especially frantic about making a plan and acting upon it.

So, guys, what do you think granny should do with her cash funds, in relation to precious metals?

All comments and advice welcome.
You guys are wonderful, by the way. Thanks

TownCrier (09/30/99; 15:27:52MDT - Msg ID:15009)
UK joins in 100% debt relief
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/business/the_economy/newsid_462000/462145.stm
Following yesterday's announcement by the U.S. president,
UK Chancellor Gordon Brown said that the UK would now consider 100% debt relief on a case-to-case basis after originally targeting a 90% level.

HopeingII (09/30/99; 15:21:06MDT - Msg ID:15008)
NYMEX Margin increases
Would anyone care to offer their opinion(s) as to the
reason for NYMEX increasing the margin requirements ?

I don't understand the significance of this.

Thanks in advance......

TownCrier (09/30/99; 14:56:53MDT - Msg ID:15007)
Brazil's Fraga says floating currency best option
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/990930/4k.html
More on floating currencies...

The president of the Brazil central bank, Arminio Fraga, told a conference in New York that Brazil was large enough and capable enough to manage its currency in a stable fashion... "a floating rate is appropriate," Fraga said.

Leigh (09/30/99; 14:51:59MDT - Msg ID:15006)
Crossroads
This is from the September 26, 1999 Norwich Bulletin:

FIRST OF ITS KIND STATE LAW LETS POLICE CONFISCATE GUNS
Associated Press

Hartford - Before Columbine High School, before the Atlanta day trader offices, before the Jewish community center in Los Angeles, there was Matthew Beck.

Beck's suicidal shooting spree at the Connecticut Lottery headquarters in March 1998 had state lawmakers considering ways to prevent such rampages well before this year's bloody toll began to mount.

In October, a new state law will allow police to take guns away from people considered an immediate danger to themselves or others. It is rooted in the notion that rampages such as Beck's are often preceded by a detectable descent into madness.

Critics of the law brand it a "turn-in-your-neighbor" statute. Supporters say the standards for seizing someone's guns are so high that the law will seldom be used.

Either way, Connecticut's law - apparently the first of its kind - is attracting attention as governments cope with the steady stream of school and workplace shootings.

The law allows any state prosecutor or two police officers to ask a judge for a warrant to take guns away from someone believed to be an immediate threat.

The warrant could be issued only after a police investigation concludes there is no other way to keep the person from doing harm. In deciding whether to issue the warrant, a judge must have evidence that the person recently tortured animals, threatened to kill himself or others, or acted violently. If guns are seized, a hearing must be held within 14 days to determine whether they should be returned....

Yet, if the law applies only when someone is an "imminent" threat, how much time do police have to conduct an investigation?

"Depending on the severity of the situation, it could be done in several hours," Kiehm said.

Rep. Richard Tulisano, a Democrat who was one of the most vocal opponents of the law, said the legislation will lead to hasty searches and bogus arrests.

"Now police can say, 'We saw you kick a dog peeing on your petunias, so now we could go in your house and look for guns because you might be dangerous,'" Tulisano said. "What happens if they're looking for guns and they find drugs? This law becomes the basis for which people could invade your home."
....
Opponents have argued that the law could be manipulated.

"Someone, anyone, can go to the police, state their belief (that) you are a danger, and they can take your guns away," said Alan Caruba, who posts his opinions on legislation and media coverage on the National Anxiety Center, a New Jersey-based Internet website. "Then there's a hearing in which you are essentially guilty until proven innocent. It's not gun control. It's the turn-in-your-neighbor law."

Critics say authorities should rely on the state's civil commitment statutes if someone poses a threat to society.

But in order to have someone committed and held against their will for more than 48 hours, the state must prove the person has a psychological disability. The new law allows police to take swifter action, Lawlor said.

Goldspoon (09/30/99; 14:46:40MDT - Msg ID:15005)
Dave
Dave,
Some times when one has a (no words in the dictionary) feeling/prophesy/vision (in my bones) no word can describe it.... they find another with the same view??? and say look.... read this i think it is important......i was being vauge in the post so others would explore the link......

i am not wired right (lots of people here will agree with this i'm sure, one way or the other)... i'm dislexic and ambidexterious sometimes it seems autistic.... another way of saying cross wired...so i get strange sensations about things.. almost a different state of being....i guess (no way to describe it)..
i can't control it... things i want to know about... i can't control it ...but i know the difference...it's not from my logical side...
Some times i have a translation problem puting it into words and rub on the glass darkly and see details not there (trying to see to hard)..with my logical side...

Read through some of my posts after this one...you'll see others on the same flavor......
Am i always right....no...when i express opinions based on logic i am right and wrong.... when it's based on (bone based feelings???) it's right alot more often than not....
That's why i'm here i was drawn here....to know something from FOA...belive me or not....does not matter to me...i don't know any of you personally... but some souls here i connect with.....

Love......God protect us....

Goldspoon (8/22/99; 17:31:11MDT - Msg ID:11791)
Leigh....Trying times....
http://63.68.60.131/
These are trying times.... i hope we at this forum can be of some comfort to you...prepare for the worst hope for the best... and take solace in the fact that you have prepared the best you can... In these last days leading up to Y2K the phropheseys are many.. One i find most interesting is contained in the link that i have provided... This man claims to be the "Last Day Phrophet of God" spoken of in the bible... one interesting prediction if his is that between August 1 and 9/9/99 God will punish many of the great cities... His prediction predated the Turkey earthquake.. he has said this punishment for the city of New York may come in the form of a stock crash... if nothing else, i find this man to be a "mystery wrapped in a riddle" and thought others may find this of interest....or not.....
I may not have gotten his phrophesy exactly straight... he may be refering to this time frame 40 days as a chance for the cities to repent and then punishment (i get confused..)

To All... my spelling, grammer... if you can read it and extract it's meaning, then it is spelled correctly... if not, my apologies.....

TownCrier (09/30/99; 14:46:28MDT - Msg ID:15004)
Korean minister sees steady won for rest of year
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/990930/0z.html
Hopefully you read and remember our GOLDEN VIEW recently explaining the prevailing movement toward free floating national currencies, with gold now set free to seek its level among them. In this article the South Korean Finance Minister was seen reiterating the government policy that it will not interfere in foreign exchange markets...except for "smoothing operations." Well, ok, so they're still going to "cheat" a little with a dirty float. Give 'em time.

CoBra(too) (09/30/99; 14:41:55MDT - Msg ID:15003)
A subsidiary of Sumitomo Metal - a nuclear processing plant
140 miles from Tokio leaked heavy radiation, 19 people directly afected and has apparently a problem with uncontolled chemical (read chain) reaction. The government called a crisiis meeting and asked USA for assistance. This does'nt sound as a small accident anymore, as the uranium processed is 5 times more powerful as at Three Mile Island.

The stuff of nightmares - I remember Tchernobyl and the dire warnings as radioactive rain hit us in central Europe - Austria stands for a nuclear free Central Europe and mothballed by popular referendum its first nuclear power plant and also vetos any prospective candidates to Euroland
if their nuclear power plants are not up to western security standards. Forgive me MK, for wandering off the golden path.

I was just thinking about Andy Smith, of (now) Mitsui, whose pathetic call upon the euro CB's to renege on the gold pact was reprinted prominently on todays FT. My first reaction, besides laughing, was "some paid serfs go to any lenght to lie through their teeth to make a buck", though some serfs at least won't give up their last self esteem in sacrificing their last bit of credibility. It is truly sad, what lies, collusion and greed can lead to. It is even more so, as many people were mislead by a guy who may have known better. Therefor, I nominate Andy Smith for the Un-Noble literature Price Winner of the millenium for un-scientific fiction on the ancient history of gold and I hope Guenter Grass (a modern author and historian of standing), who is this years real laureate will forgive my allegory.

As we now have arrived at early stages of the greatest bull market in pm's we'll ever experience, I feel privileged to have found this site early on my journey through the internet. Therefor I would like to thank all posters, and of course MK and TC, for never wavering in their beliefs and for the great and ongoing insights into the gold markets, we all are addicted to.
Cheers CB2

gidsek (09/30/99; 14:13:21MDT - Msg ID:15002)
Squeeze play
Sorry, not a very good answer. I guess "squeeze play" is deliberate action (agressive buying) to force a short covering rally as detailed below. Short covering rallies occur naturally all the time but I guess the term "squeeze" means that the action is planned.

gidsek

gidsek (09/30/99; 14:01:35MDT - Msg ID:15001)
apdchief .. Squeeze Play
apdchief (09/30/99; 10:23:09MDT - Msg ID:14981)
Squeeze Play
"I recently read on a board where there were rumors that someone or a group of someones were going to try to 'squeeze the december gold contract.' Can anyone fill me in on what is meant by 'squeezing' a contract?"

Possibly you read it on this board, from GATA relayed by Chris Powell late last night, (check yesterdays posts).

You have been witnessing a "squeeze" with this breakout. Those who are short begin to break, and buy in order to cover their short positions. This of course drives the price up and aggravates (or enhances! :) ) the situation, flushing out more shorts. The result is a very strong short covering rally.

When some investors sense that the short-interest in anything is lopsided and vulnerable, they some times start this avalanche deliberately (by buying agressively). I guess the rumour refers to action we can expect on the December '99 gold contract, wether deliberate or not is not clear.

gidsek

Dave (09/30/99; 13:33:14MDT - Msg ID:15000)
Goldspoon, Re: Msg # 14997
Could you please give me the message # to your big city judgement post? Thanks

TownCrier (09/30/99; 13:27:59MDT - Msg ID:14999)
Sir Goldfly and gold
If size won't move at price, its over. This market won't function on a pocket full of ounces.

Two items:

1) A bid price at an auction for gold that exceeded the spot price where, theoretically at least, one should have been able to fill any order at that price. Why pay a higher price at an auction unless you knew the spot market couldn't deliver your order's size? Apparently many felt this way. The auction was eight times oversubscribed, and though we don't know what percentage of that entered unsuccessful bids, we do know that there were several successful bidders (Gold Fields walked away with only 3+ tonnes). And remember, the gold went at the lowest of the qualifying priuces. These people did not offer high bids simply to waste dollars above spot price. They knew thay had no choice if they wanted gold in any size.

2) COMEX is a hedging desk first and foremost. Not only do speculators operate there on a cash basis, but so do the producers and consumers. They'll often hedge their cash exposures at COMEX while moving their gold at market prices through their preferred distribution chain. To see this latest trend of contracts postions being utilized as a source for gold delivery speaks of similar supply problems through spot markets as the auction example. Size won't move at price. When our visitor arrived with the news that 4-point-6 tonnes had been asked for on this first notice day for delivery on the COMEX October contracts, he said those who don't have gold by now never will.

That was a bit of a generalization, but in essence, given the past two years of global financial turmoil, war, bubble markets, and proximity of Y2K, and opportunities to buy in the $250 range...if you've held out from buying through all of that, the only event capable of inspiring your interest in physical gold will also be the event that spooks the herd. The herd will only be spooked when it is obvious that they have missed the boat, and you with them. So as long as the players needing orders filled of size are willing and able to secure their supply off the spot market, then that guy in New York may be tempted to sell his 5 ounces to MK in this "orderly gold market" during this rally so that he may invest his cash in Something.com. Meanwhile you call MK and walk away with this last remaining gold to hit the open market.

Peter Asher (09/30/99; 13:09:24MDT - Msg ID:14998)
Kitco computer
One link shows silver closing down .07, another up .01

Dec. silver closed up .008, so the +.01 is probably the correct read.

Goldspoon (09/30/99; 13:03:54MDT - Msg ID:14997)
Leigh,
Some good points.... Clinton is a puppet..... BIG "Very OLD" MONEY runs the WORLD..... This is the true source of USA's might... hence the tie to England... ask Thomas Jefferson he knew....America won political freedom but has never been out of the clutches of the economic slavery one....
The UN is a political body and may determine political/physical.. slavery/freedom.....But the economic freedom of the world has been in the same hands for over 300 years and for 7 and 1/2 more...

Remember about a month and a half ago.... i said judjment was about to come to the major cities of the world...to recap..Istanbul...Athens...Saltlake City...Tipei...Tokeo...Mexico City....New York....etc..
Sorry...... i don't make the news....

RossL (09/30/99; 12:25:11MDT - Msg ID:14996)
If you haven't got gold by now, the rider that just arrived at our Tower says you never will
TC sez:
"...our rider reports that of these remaining October contracts, today alone delivery intensions were announced for 1,483.

That's 148,300 ounces...4.61 tonnes."

I can't believe this didn't cause an immediate wave of short covering at the COMEX. What's going on? Are the shorts intending to deliver all that physical to the approved warehouses?

Leigh (09/30/99; 12:24:51MDT - Msg ID:14995)
Typo in Last Post
That's "frighten" the citizens too much.

Leigh (09/30/99; 12:23:23MDT - Msg ID:14994)
Goldspoon
Goldspoon, this is just a thought I thought up. How do you know our leaders WANT to protect our country's number one status? Clinton is doing everything in his power to weaken and bankrupt this nation. I read somewhere about how a lot of the UN-type thinkers want to destroy national sovreignty, and we are the most independent-minded country of all.

I had another thought this morning about something Mr. Holtzman said. He said wise rulers never the citizens too much, especially during emergencies. Who said Clinton is wise? Remember right after his first inauguration? That's when the term "politically correct" came into being (who had ever heard such a thing before?). Right away there was a big push for health care reform, etc., etc. They're now hoping to achieve the same goals "incrementally" (so no one will notice until it's too late), but who says that if there's a Y2K emergency Clinton won't try to push his whole agenda on to us?

Chicken man (09/30/99; 12:00:56MDT - Msg ID:14993)
T C - Hot off the press from the horses mouth...!

For more information, please visit our sponsor.

Exchange News
View Most Recent | View by Organization | Contributors

Release Date: Sep 29 1999

NYMEX Increasing Margins On Gold, Silver And Platinum Futures

NEW YORK, N.Y., September 29, 1999 - The New York Mercantile Exchange will
increase the margins on its gold, silver, and platinum futures contracts as of the close of
business today.

Margins on gold will be raised to $1,600 from $800 for clearing members; to $1,760
from $880 for members; and to $2,160 from $1,080 for customers. Silver margins will
be increased to $1,500 from $1,200 for clearing members; to $1,650 from $1,320 for
members; and to $2,025 from $1,620 for customers. Platinum margins will be raised to
$1,100 from $900 for clearing members; to $1,210 from $990 for members; and to
$1,485 from $1,215 for customers.

Don't be the least bit "surprised" to see more of these "announcements"....!

Goldspoon (09/30/99; 11:59:30MDT - Msg ID:14992)
Elevator Guy, FOA...and the cornered Rats.........*Recomended Reading*
Whoa....last thing i remember was Goldflys dogs running in circles around my horse (with no name). i got dizzy and fell off!..... FOA, Koan it's OK guys don't stop for me!... on with the Race!! i'm ready to climb back on!
The shorts are raising money by selling rises in the price of anything as we speak...and preparing a defence....

SERIOUSLY NOW.........i want to speak to all.....Read carefully......
FOA's (09/30/99; 08:17:39MDT - Msg ID:14966)
and
Elevator Guy's (9/29/99; 21:49:39MDT - Msg ID:14932)

ARE DEAD ON THE TRUTH!!!!! Yes, the truth is out there... and they know it.......but.....

"CAUTION" the rats are cornered....and as i have stated here before......they will fight....Smith is already crying his eyes out for a rule change.....will he get it from the Europeans??? No.....not yet....
But..... The USA is used to being top dog....and England is the largest forign investor in the USA (you thought Japan was? no way) they may yet break ranks.... no not yet... but when push comes to shove on the USA going from "Might to Midget" not without a fight.....
This whole thing is going to get unpredictible.......
Technicaly FOA has it down pat....(my hat is off to you sir).... But, his equations lack one little thing and he has left this out of the mix before........Some of what will happen along the road to 30,000 will contain some human feelings and nothing to do with logic.....Look for extremes from the USA before we get to 30k... even martial law by Clinton....
BUT.....
Most likely ***** A deal struck between the European Union and the USA....a middle ground... after all armegedon for the USA is also suicide for Europe...and they won't let it go that far.....the Europeans will share power in the end...

Gold???...regulated (NEW RULES) What will they be??? Middle ground.... the world excapes total colapse of the Dollar so..some of the shorts will excape via bailout (remember LTCM?)... Price of Gold??? Higher.... but maybe not 30k (then again?)....
That's why i'm hedgeing with Platinum/gold/silver rare coins.....
My crystal ball won't let me read the new rules...not just yet..........

REMEMBER Goldspoon's Golden Rule??? .."He who has the Gold makes the rules, BUT he who has the "Might" (USA,England) decides what gold is and who has it"

England is fractured right now LOOK for a big infight to erupt over this........

One more piece of advice... remember playing "Monoply" as a kid..you changed the rules.... so everyone could still play!!!
Will happen this time too..........

Leigh (09/30/99; 11:44:06MDT - Msg ID:14991)
Crossroads
Crossroads, I don't have a computer link, but in our recycling can I have a copy of Sunday's paper. I'll retype the article for you later today (gotta leave for a while now). This is a really nasty new law.

Chicken man (09/30/99; 11:37:57MDT - Msg ID:14990)
Stranger -Surfing the FDIC.....caught a big wave...!
http://www.fdic.gov/news/news/press/1999/pr9946b.html
Seems Houston has a big problem......I don't know much about this "information" but that the fed wants this system to work...!
Do you know what this is about.....?

Chicken man (09/30/99; 11:05:36MDT - Msg ID:14989)
Town Crier @ "Risk of a Default....?"
Hey..TC...is this a new "d" word...? this "protest" is against the feds new "rating" system for colaterial of the US banks for the Y2K run on the banks.....they now can "pledge" to the fed a new group of investments .....it was in the news about a week ago....meanwhile...somebody explain to me why the "D" word....?

Under the new proposal the ratings of the debtors would determine how much capital a bank needed to cover a potential risk of a default and bankers said there
were far more rated companies in the United States than in Europe.

ORO (09/30/99; 11:04:24MDT - Msg ID:14988)
Goldfly
Again, the actual considerations are in the market maker's head and computer algorithms (probably much patched up now).

From a short and very rough look at the numbers it seems that the spread is a function of lease rates and of volatility.
It stands at whatever the market will bear. Meaning that the urgency in trader's actions is sufficient to not shop for lower spreads. So if the market seems to expect swings of much more than 1% then traders would not be bothered by spreads of 1%, particularly when facing margin calls (where price expectations have little meaning).
So it normally stands at 1/10 to 1/3 or so of the lease rate plus a cost driven minimum plus a portion of the volatility.

Right now we have increased the spreads up to $5, or 1.75%, and back down to $2.5 to $3.

Goldfly (09/30/99; 10:56:42MDT - Msg ID:14987)
Townie!! Your #14983

"If you haven't got gold by now, ..... you never will."

Is that hyperbole? Or are you talking serious doo-doo?

NORTH OF 49 (09/30/99; 10:51:54MDT - Msg ID:14986)
Leigh
My Lady, you are too kind. I sincerely hope that your children recover soon, as well as yourself. If ours were any indication, they are quite resiliant but will worry the life out of you at times.
On the contrary, "first-class er..arguer!!" was the farthest from my wifes' mind when I commented on your "inspirational" abilities. She, as well as all of the rest of us here at the Castle, have watched you grow from a timid, inquesitive poster to the powerhouse of understanding and proclaimation that rose to the occasion during the Castles' latest contest. Although mostly non-confrontational (a trait I soon learned to value during third-world assignments) I am still reminded of your "Now looky here girl...!!!" post to Chris some months ago--quite entertaining.
A sidebar, a couple of days ago your referred to a Post from me about a piece on Asian jewelry. To be honest, if I had to write two sentences on the subject, I'ld be stuck!! So, in fairness to the Knight who, indeed, did write said post, I shall renege the credit.
Exciting times eh? (sorry, it's a Canadian thing)
No49

Bill (09/30/99; 10:44:50MDT - Msg ID:14985)
Goldfly & apdchief
Good questions from both. I also await for those answers.
Margin requirements are usually based upon volitility. It's very natural that they would raise it after Gold showing such an increased level.

Hill Billy Mitchell (09/30/99; 10:43:53MDT - Msg ID:14984)
Oro (bid-ask spreads)
Re: your post

ORO (09/30/99; 10:09:38MDT - Msg ID:14977)
Bid Ask
Notice how bid ask spreads have widened?

Usually they are 0.5
They were at 1 to 1.5 over the early London session, rising to 2.
They are now at 2.50 - 3 and drag into 3.5.
Very high for the current "low" volatility in the market.
Someone is very defensive.

The someone who is very defensive is the Broker. Volume must be high even though volatility has settled down somewhat. They are afraid that the volatility will return. I am sure that many of them got burned confirming deals when they did not have their end of the physical locked in. All kinds of rumors are that the physical is not all that available at these prices and volumes. Thus I would think that the spreads reflect supply demand problems are the main culprits for increased spreads. This is a sign of things to come as the volatility will surely return and be a rocky ride for every link on the food chain.

TownCrier (09/30/99; 10:41:16MDT - Msg ID:14983)
If you haven't got gold by now, the rider that just arrived at our Tower says you never will
Open interest in the COMEX October futures stood at 2,139 contracts as the day began yesterday. We don't know how many of those positions may have been closed in yesterday's trading with cash, or how many new contracts may have been added. We do know this...our rider reports that of these remaining October contracts, today alone delivery intensions were announced for 1,483.

That's 148,300 ounces...4.61 tonnes.

By way of contrast, 1 silver contract was called for.

Goldfly (09/30/99; 10:24:51MDT - Msg ID:14982)
ORO

I sure have noticed the spread in bid/ask getting wider.

How does this impact trading? How is the spread determined?

apdchief (09/30/99; 10:23:09MDT - Msg ID:14981)
Squeeze Play
I recently read on a board where there were rumors that someone or a group of someones were going to try to 'squeeze the december gold contract.' Can anyone fill me in on what is meant by 'squeezing' a contract?

Also, last evening on Kitco, someone posted comments regarding the NYMEX margin increase. They stated that a margin is 'generally' set at 3 to 5% of the value of a delivered contract. Is this accurate? If so, at a 5% level, this equates to $432/oz gold.

Thanks to all of you for the continuing education here at USAGOLD.

Best Regards.

TownCrier (09/30/99; 10:22:04MDT - Msg ID:14980)
BOJ's September dollar-buy estimated at $9.71 billion
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/990930/f4.html
Realize that in their effort to "artificially" weaken the yen, the Japanese are also "artificially" making the dollar appear stronger that it would otherwise be. Take advantage of this situation to make your graceful exit to a stronger currency. The Tower recommends...gold.

Crossroads (09/30/99; 10:19:59MDT - Msg ID:14979)
Leigh
Leigh, do you have any documentation ar a link that we can veiw regarding the law in Conneticut that allows officers to search for guns?

TownCrier (09/30/99; 10:12:21MDT - Msg ID:14978)
Hey, nice Market Report, Sir MK! How's life over at the Castle?
http://www.usagold.com/cpmforum/archives/2919999/default.html
Looks like we've both called Andy Smith to task over his errant ways. You are a strong ally for this volunteer army we have assembled 'round The Tower here. Let us hope the Knights assembled at this Round Table can also help to cut through the foggy web of spells cast by Mr. Smith.

Anyone who missed it can gain a little more insight on the contrast between Mr. Smith's past pronouncements and reality by clicking the link above and scrolling down to yesterday's GOLDEN VIEW at----TownCrier (9/29/99 - Msg ID:14928)

ORO (09/30/99; 10:09:38MDT - Msg ID:14977)
Bid Ask
Notice how bid ask spreads have widened?

Usually they are 0.5
They were at 1 to 1.5 over the early London session, rising to 2.
They are now at 2.50 - 3 and drag into 3.5.
Very high for the current "low" volatility in the market.
Someone is very defensive.

TownCrier (09/30/99; 09:58:17MDT - Msg ID:14976)
Fed says it added $5.660 bln reserves to the banking system via RPs
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/990930/o0.html
Fed funds were trading at 5-5/8% (above the Fed's 5-1/4% target for the rate) at the time of the operation.

USAGOLD (09/30/99; 09:57:42MDT - Msg ID:14975)
USAGOLD Report: Andy Smith Goes to the Central Banks
MARKET ANALYSIS (9/30/99):

Day Four of the Big Breakout....

Perhaps the most interesting day of the breakout -- not so much in terms of price action but
what is revealed about the behind-the-scenes players (See the first link below). For the past
several years, Andy Smith has been among the leaders of the anti-gold movement. Not a
week went by that Andy Smith was being quoted somewhere in the financial press that gold
was a barbarous relic no longer relevant in the world's monetary system; that it was a mere
commodity like soybeans or porkbellies and, as such, no longer considered money by
central bankers, metals brokers and others of the financially correct "City" elite; that it was
on its way out as money, as a commodity, as anything. Little better than dirt, gold would
someday attain the value of dirt. So he said in so many words -- and usually with a good
portion of arrogance and belittlement thrown in.

Smith churned out report after report that turned out to be nothing more than thinly
disguised sales pitches to the central banks to either sell or lease their gold because it was a
dead asset that just sat on the balance sheet doing nothing -- a non-performer. The takers
were usually third world central banks in need of income anywhere they could find it.
During the whole time Andy Smith and others were making these public pronouncements, I
never once heard a prominent central banker utter anything close to a public agreement. It
was always Andy Smith and his like-minded fellows saying that this is what central bankers
believed, not the central bankers themselves. As a matter of fact prominent American central
bankers (like Alan Greenspan and Paul Volcker) time and again made public
pronouncements decidedly on the other side of the fence from Mr. Smith. By the way, so
did members of the Swiss central bank, the French central bank, and the German central
bank -- all key players on the world financial and gold scene. All of this rhetoric was a
necessary accompaniment to the very lucrative gold carry trade of which you have heard so
much about on these pages. The greatest danger was a rising gold price, rising lease rates --
in fact, the very scary possibility that the central banks might close down the pipeline. Well,
last Sunday night when the European Union made its declaration (which can be accessed
below) that pipeline indeed shut down. I cannot prove that Mr. Smith was talking his book
all these years; he has deftly avoided telling us. At the same time, I cannot understand how
someone would have such a defined and stubborn dislike for gold and gold investors if not
for a defined and stubborn financial interest.

This morning we find that Mr. Smith, who now works for Mitsui, is no longer "talking his
book." Instead he is "begging his book." His statement this morning as reported by
Financial Times London (Thanks SteveH) smacks of desperation: "This is now a
disorderly market. Gold is still a reserve asset. If you had conditions like this in the bond or
foreign exchange markets, it would not be allowed to continue....Over the last three days
gold has been trading like a commodity, not like money. Volatility has shot up; the cost of
options has shot up; the cost of borrowing has shot up. The situation is untenable." He
went on beg the European banks to urgently review their strategy."

This may all be in the interest of "an orderly market" as he says, but the situation is every
bit as urgent as he says -- especially if you are short the market. Underneath it all, his
statement that conditions like this in the bond and foreign exchange markets "would not be
allowed to continue" reveals a misplaced belief in statist institutions that control our destiny
not a free market. Did he ever consider that these statist interventions in the gold market --
the gold carry trade -- would have to end someday the result of free market forces?
Apparently not. Now he wants those same institutions, who have decided they no longer
want to risk their most fundamentally important asset, to bail out the rapidly imploding gold
carry trade of which he may be a part. Virtual Gold's Jessica Cross added in the same
article: "We are going to see some casualties."

Now, after all these years of trying to make gold just another commodity, Andy Smith
claims it is "money" and the central banks should do something to stop the carnage in the
gold carry trade -- carnage we feel is going to drive gold through the roof. Perhaps he
should reconsider his position. There's plenty of room on this side of the ball for another
gold bull. He would take his position right next to Bill O'Neil of Merrill Lynch who made
his public conversion to goldmeister just two days ago.

Those of you visiting USAGOLD for the first time should follow the links listed in the Daily Report (which can be accessed from the menu above) if you are
curious about what's happening in the gold market.

TownCrier (09/30/99; 09:55:08MDT - Msg ID:14974)
Bundesbank 's Meister-Basle draft promises more fairness
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/990930/il.html
Bundesbank directorate member Edgar Meister recommends changes to the Basle Accord for international banking capital adequacy requirements...currently banks are called to set aside at least 8% of their assets with at least 4% of assets made up of tier-one or core capital such as equity.

Some of those european banks can really give a guy reason to pause and say, "Hey, nice assets."

TownCrier (09/30/99; 09:41:27MDT - Msg ID:14973)
Russia mulls ending gold export tax from Oct 28
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/990930/hs.html
Russia debates the future of their real-money policy...

Journeyman (09/30/99; 09:40:39MDT - Msg ID:14972)
Gold graph source
http://kitco.ca/image/s_gold.gif
Talk about "siezing up" -- all the current gold price graphical sites seem to be previewing the "unwinding" of the metal markets themselves. Try loading just the kitco gif at the above URL. For some reason it seems to be staying up to date. (Now that the info's out on the main BBS tho, it'll probly sieze up too!) Regards, Journeyman

TownCrier (09/30/99; 09:37:15MDT - Msg ID:14971)
Russian Sberbank to buy 33 T gold directly in '99
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/990930/dv.html
The Russian state owns a controlling stake in the nation's largest commmercial bank...which has already purchased 15 tonnes of gold from Russian producers, saying at the beginning of the year its goal had been to obtain 50 tonnes.

Goldfly (09/30/99; 09:36:36MDT - Msg ID:14970)
Wowees!

Spot and Spike are just tumbling all over the place!

We're ooching higher!

$302.10

Leigh (09/30/99; 09:13:27MDT - Msg ID:14969)
Black Blade/North of 49
Hi, Black Blade! Thank you for the information about Asian jewelry. When I lived in Guam there was an Air Force wife of Vietnamese descent who imported beautiful handmade items, including carved marble boxes and tea sets, dolls, and so on. One day she was showing some jewelry and explaining about the Thai baht links. There were gemstoned items, too. At that time I wasn't interested in gold jewelry (most of mine is platinum), so I scarcely looked. What a mistake! Her prices were dirt cheap, and everything she sold was gorgeous. Well, I did pick up a lot of bargains over there, just not jewelry. When my toddler gets past the danger age, I'll be able to bring them out into the light of day!

North of 49 -- I hope I'm not getting a bad reputation as a first-class er...arguer!! For over a week now I've had sick kids, and I'm very tired and low on patience. You're such a nice guy that I can't imagine your wife resorting to that!

Leigh (09/30/99; 08:42:59MDT - Msg ID:14968)
SteveH
There's a new law in Connecticut that makes it legal for police to search your home for weapons and confiscate them if anyone complains that you might possibly be a threat to society.

SteveH (09/30/99; 08:29:46MDT - Msg ID:14967)
Onlychild
Yes I did. Feel free to pass along.

FOA, good posts. Don't be in such a hurry, makes it seem like the gold market is falling apart (smile, with sadness).

FOA (09/30/99; 08:17:39MDT - Msg ID:14966)
Had to come back for this!
http://www2.techstocks.com/stocktalk/msg.gsp?msgid=11405275
September 27, 1999. Shades of de Gaulle: The New, New World of Gold

By its stunning announcement Sunday evening, the new European Central Bank served notice that it will not tolerate politically motivated Anglo-American interference in the gold market, and that the Bank of England is now on probation as the central bank with principal responsibility for overseeing this important market. The details of the announcement have received full coverage by the financial press and wire services. Only time will reveal its full significance. But what already seems clear is that not since
Charles de Gaulle and the Banque de France mounted the Franco-American gold war in the 1960's has a European central bank so directly confronted Anglo-American hegemony over the international monetary system. And this time it is not merely a European central bank, but the European Central Bank.

The classical international gold standard became an unintended casualty of the First World War. Ever since, first the British and then the Americans have essentially dictated the basic features of the world monetary system: the gold exchange standard after World
War I, Bretton Woods after World War II, and floating rates after Viet Nam. Each time the new system finally led to an unprecedented credit expansion and an equally unprecedented bull market in stocks. But the process of unwinding the great bull markets of the 1920's and the 1960's brought down the very international monetary systems that spawned them. The final outcome of floating exchange rates and the great bull market of the 1990's is yet to be written. However, the advent of the Euro was intended to make Europe what perhaps no single European country could be: a necessary player in any future fundamental restructuring of the international monetary system.

For now, the gold market itself may provide sufficient fireworks. One-year lease rates today hit 4.7% as existing shorts scrambled to secure adequate borrowings. Under the circumstances, the odds for one or more high visibility failures or defaults cannot be insignificant. In the longer run, Sunday's announcement by the ECB may be just the first shot in a far larger battle for long overdue and much-needed reform of the world's monetary system. But in any event, it is a reminder that what General de Gaulle termed
"an exorbitant privilege" -- the dollar's key currency status -- cannot be maintained indefinitely by a policy of trashing gold.

FOA (9/30/99; 7:59:42MDT - Msg ID:14965)
(No Subject)
Someone just shot the "horse with no name", Platinum? Leigh?? (smile)

SteveH, Mr, Smith used to think gold was a commodity, just like silver or copper. I bet his clients are about to make him an "unneeded commodity" also?

I'm stepping away for a while, FOA

FOA (9/30/99; 7:18:47MDT - Msg ID:14964)
Further!
All:
I'm doing this in a big rush, so in the last post,

Force Major = Force Majeure = can't honour commitments

Also, Even if the Russian gold is lent, it only creates a liability to Russia and another gold loan in the future will be needed to repay that loan. Through out history, panics are created when people run from lending assets for the purpose of covering someone else's loses. Usually, exposure, is what brings on the run. The ECB has just exposed the system. The run has begun.

Thanks all FOA

FOA (9/30/99; 7:05:31MDT - Msg ID:14963)
Comment
Why did it stop?

It didn't!

Part of the process of buying "real gold" is in the waiting for allocation. Be it actual delivery of metal, receipt of certificates for "real vault deposit" or just clearing out the cash settlement of trades gone bad. This all takes time, especially when such a large segment of the
market has just been "cleaned out" financially. On the surface, new traders continue to put up their $2,000 or so of margin money and trade the Comex for some paper cash. Underneath it all, a mad scramble is going on to find gold to meet all the failed commitments. For many of the major trade houses (and BBs), they now must use their own capital to carry the dead positions of others. Most of them will (or already have) covered their financial (read that cash) positions in the paper markets. However, they must still process the real nature of the trade, "find new real gold to
replace what was lent". Like this: "We sold the gold and lent the money to a fund to trade with. If that fund cannot put up more capital to back the loan (because the price of gold has gone so far against him), and pay the higher rental rate (now in effect) when his 1 to 6 month loan comes due;
We will attach his assets and sell them off to buy the gold back ourselves."

This whole cat and mouse game can take a while as everyone sweats the outcome. Right now, many of those funds are so far under water on their "financial trades" (example: short Yen at 125), that a sell off of their "book" leaves little. SO, the bank has to borrow gold against it's own capital and pay the new "lease rate" as it "fully allocates" (returns) the gold position to the lender (mostly private entities). The gold owner (and lender) cannot and will not just sit there and watch the collateral (the trading book of the hedge fund) for the loan go up in smoke. Especially if the lease rate is skyrocketing from an "obvious major world shortage of gold"! Even if the bank is successful in borrowing gold, they still must one day buy in the open market to refund the second gold loan. They can go round and round, borrowing gold to replace the "last" deal. All the while driving the lending rate higher and higher as more and more lenders back out at any lease rate offered.

The LBMA statement about high lease rates bring out new gold for leasing is flawed. Often 20% (and higher) currency rates in failing third world counties does not bring in any new private capital. Usually government money is needed. In like view, we see how the ECB has now blocked new official gold to support a market that private lenders are now running from. It's like the US saying:

"we will no longer back the Mexican treasury market and the private sector will have to do it".

All of this takes time as it slowly unwinds (fails). Without major official gold supplies, this gold market is going to grind to a complete halt. The day traders (that currently run in and out) will one day find the entire system "force major" and their margins frozen. Of course, they will be settled in cash, but only after the "street gold" price runs into the many thousands.

With this in view, do we now see why "taking delivery" of each and every ounce (just like GS and ML are doing on Comex) is so important. Your "big" paper gains from settled cash trades (and mining shares), that will look "oh so huge", will be almost nothing to buy gold with after the turn.

In fact, they may unload a paper selling spree on the markets, that crunches the price down, "just before it completely locks up"!!!

Think about it? Then: Think about how your assets will hold up?

Got the view of what is ahead?

On the road to $30,000,,,,Yes? FOA

onlychild (9/30/99; 7:05:12MDT - Msg ID:14962)
Steve H
Re: "Protecting your gold" That's priceless! Did you write that?

GarySmith (9/30/99; 6:25:14MDT - Msg ID:14961)
GOLD COMEX (100 Troy oz. ; $/troy oz)
http://www.nvo.com/pdgcconsult/forecastsfor6monthsaboutcurrenciescommoditiesstocksindicesbo/
I expect GOLD COMEX to go up during November'99 and to be volatile during the month. It is difficult to explain the actual graph forecast and those who wish to calculate figures and see more details can view the actual graph forecast by clicking on the link shown.

SteveH (9/30/99; 6:12:13MDT - Msg ID:14960)
cake and eat it too!
http://www.ft.com/hippocampus/q186442.htm
GOLD: Banks urged to rethink ban
By Gillian O'Connor, Mining Correspondent

A second day of chaos in the gold market left some analysts arguing that European central banks would have to revise the restrictions on gold sales and lending announced on Sunday.

"This is now a disorderly market," said Andy Smith of Mitsui, one of the most respected gold analysts. "Gold is still a reserve asset. If you had conditions like this in the bond or foreign exchange markets, it would not be allowed to continue.

"Over the last three days gold has been trading like a commodity, not like money. Volatility has shot up; the cost of options has shot up; the cost of borrowing has shot up. The situation is untenable." Mr Smith called for the European banks to urgently review their strategy.

"We are going to see some casualties," said Jessica Cross of Virtual Gold Research, an independent consultant.

On Sunday 15 European banks agreed to restrict their actual sales (to 2,000 tonnes over five years and 400 tonnes in any single year) and "not to expand their gold leasings and their use of gold futures and options over this [five year] period". It is the cap on leasing that has caused liquidity to dry up overnight.

The announcement prompted an $11 rise to $281.10 an ounce on Monday and, yesterday, the London price fluctuated within a $20 range in early trading. It was fixed at $317.25 an ounce in the morning, up from $301.50 the previous afternoon, and the highest fix since October 24, 1997. But it was down to $307 by the afternoon fix, and around $300 by the close of dealing in London. The spot price moved above the forward price, which is very unusual for gold, though quite common in illiquid commodity markets.

At around $3, spreads between buying and selling prices were 10 times the norm. The cost of options soared and lease rates - the cost of borrowing gold - soared to 10 per cent at one point, compared with the long-term norm of 1-2 per cent.

RossL (9/30/99; 5:54:37MDT - Msg ID:14959)
Article on gold short covering in WSJ
The "Heard on the Street" column on page C2 of the WSJ this morning is of interest to all of us. Felix Freeman of Scotia Capital is quoted saying there is more short covering to come.

FOA (9/30/99; 5:53:07MDT - Msg ID:14958)
Comment
elevator guy (9/29/99; 21:49:39MDT - Msg ID:14932)

Hello elevator guy,
I'm still alive after all this excitement. No calls to travel, yet? Your post carries the exact same flavour that many other analysts are coming to grasp. Each person must see it in their own way, but I believe you understand it well. As the events unfold they will reinforce your convictions to hold the course.

The wind is at your back,,,, sails full,,,,,,,,, far ahead of the rest. Don't make the mistake of looking right or left, your success is directly ahead. We are on the road now...........FOA

RossL (9/30/99; 5:39:21MDT - Msg ID:14957)
From Gata re: investment strategy
714 quoted this:
"Guys like Kaplan can cost you a lot of money.
He refers to all the shorts having covered,
knowing perfectly well, but hoping you don't
know, that he is talking only about the Comex
futures shorts. No one even knows how much
physical gold was shorted, borrowed from
central banks and bullion banks, all of which
has to be paid back. It must be a huge amount,
as they have managed to drive the price so
low in the face of strong fundamentals."

"Where will they get it? Not from me -- not
until they're ready to pay SERIOUS bucks for
it. I don't want to be greedy but I've
waited a long time for this."

The morning WSJ shows 2139 Oct gold contracts open at the COMEX. What happens if 75% want delivery of physical? Hahhahaaaaa How 'bout some limit up days? The monthly contracts are not backwardated yet, though. Silver contracts start backwardating in the '00 contracts.

SteveH (9/30/99; 2:17:05MDT - Msg ID:14956)
Mouse pad double click submit, sorry!
Hey Peter, you up. I must head of to be again but things are quiet for now. Dec. gold (backwardized now) at $303.00

SteveH (9/30/99; 2:14:59MDT - Msg ID:14955)
Please tolerate a slight digression
Protecting your gold:

Most State Constitutions on the right to bear Arms read:

Every person has a right to keep and bear arms for the defense of himself and the state.

If rewritten to show what it actually means today would read:

Every person, who is not a felon or ex-felon, who is not insane, who isn't under a warrant for arrest, who is not a spouse-abusor, who is not a drug dealer, who isn't insane, who hasn't got a restraining order against them, has a right to keep (but to buy or obtain an arm you must be scrutinized by a national record check for the above) registered arms as long as the paperwork is with it -- but not an assault rifle, nor a sawed-off shotgun, nor a black jack, nor a machine gun, nor a bazooka, nor a double-edged knife, nor gun with more than 15-rounds -- at home or at work, except it should be locked up and unloaded to prevent children from getting to it and injuring themselves, AND to bear arms on the exterior of your garments (non-concealed) -- while hunting or fishing or while walking in public except in schools and churches (where most notable shootings occur), except in theaters, bars, cars (must be locked up in the trunk and unloaded, except in Massachusettes where it is mandatory jail sentence for having a gun in a trunk unloaded) where an entourage of law enforcement officers will stop and question you as to why you are wearing a non-concealed loaded or unloaded weapon in public and outraged parents will write letters of complaint about the arm being carried in plain view -- AND concealed -- if you have a license, which in most states a board must decide if you are elligible and may deny for no compelling reason other than it is 'the policy' (which would require you spending money for an attorney) -- for the defense of himself or herself and the state if the sitituation warrants deadly force (and the force best be deadly so the one shot doesn't live to sue you) but the proper and acceptable weapon can't be pulled or shown without just cause, which definition vary from state to state, county to county AND you can't loan your gun out and if it is stolen and not reported in five days you comitted a crime and if it is stolen by a child and discovered or used in a crime then you are as guilty as they are.

Question: On whose watch did that happen?

Comment: The Federal Constitution just had a court case that figure out that the right to bear arms is an individual right and not a state right (people vs emmerson).

Makes you wonder, eh?

SteveH (9/30/99; 2:14:54MDT - Msg ID:14954)
Please tolerate a slight digression
Protecting your gold:

Most State Constitutions on the right to bear Arms read:

Every person has a right to keep and bear arms for the defense of himself and the state.

If rewritten to show what it actually means today would read:

Every person, who is not a felon or ex-felon, who is not insane, who isn't under a warrant for arrest, who is not a spouse-abusor, who is not a drug dealer, who isn't insane, who hasn't got a restraining order against them, has a right to keep (but to buy or obtain an arm you must be scrutinized by a national record check for the above) registered arms as long as the paperwork is with it -- but not an assault rifle, nor a sawed-off shotgun, nor a black jack, nor a machine gun, nor a bazooka, nor a double-edged knife, nor gun with more than 15-rounds -- at home or at work, except it should be locked up and unloaded to prevent children from getting to it and injuring themselves, AND to bear arms on the exterior of your garments (non-concealed) -- while hunting or fishing or while walking in public except in schools and churches (where most notable shootings occur), except in theaters, bars, cars (must be locked up in the trunk and unloaded, except in Massachusettes where it is mandatory jail sentence for having a gun in a trunk unloaded) where an entourage of law enforcement officers will stop and question you as to why you are wearing a non-concealed loaded or unloaded weapon in public and outraged parents will write letters of complaint about the arm being carried in plain view -- AND concealed -- if you have a license, which in most states a board must decide if you are elligible and may deny for no compelling reason other than it is 'the policy' (which would require you spending money for an attorney) -- for the defense of himself or herself and the state if the sitituation warrants deadly force (and the force best be deadly so the one shot doesn't live to sue you) but the proper and acceptable weapon can't be pulled or shown without just cause, which definition vary from state to state, county to county AND you can't loan your gun out and if it is stolen and not reported in five days you comitted a crime and if it is stolen by a child and discovered or used in a crime then you are as guilty as they are.

Question: On whose watch did that happen?

Comment: The Federal Constitution just had a court case that figure out that the right to bear arms is an individual right and not a state right (people vs emmerson).

Makes you wonder, eh?

Peter Asher (9/30/99; 2:11:02MDT - Msg ID:14953)
Backwardation
At the close on Comex today: Backwardation on futures and low premium on Spot/Dec.

- - Gold - - Silver

Spot 302 - - - Spot 563

Dec 302.5 - - - Dec 5.61

Feb 282.8 - - - Mar 5.14

Apr 282.9 - - - May 5.05

Jun 261.6

Aug 258.6

R.Deutsch (9/30/99; 2:00:42MDT - Msg ID:14952)
Silver contra gold
There was an interesting discussion going on here, about Silver or gold as the better investment.Here are some reasons, why silver in my opinion will outperform gold:

1.)Throughout history the main monetary metal was silver not gold. It was just a very short time in history (1870-1971) that gold was made the sole monetary metal by governement (not by the market).

2.) Silver today is valued as a commodity only, whereas gold is still valued as money.

3.) If gold would be valued as a commodity today, the price would be maybe 50 to 80 Dollars per ounce. Nobody really needs gold as a commodity and we have about 50 years of production in store.

4.) Silver is increasingly needed as a commodity and it will be the first metal that can really become scarce as a commodity.

5.) The big surprise will be the reinvention of commodity money. Poeple will learn again, that there are two completely different kinds of money - commodity money and credit money - and this surprise will affect gold and silver in the same way.

6.) Silver will have to catch up first the normal money realation of about 1:15 (dictaded by nature). But this relation might go to 1:10 or even 1:5, since silver will have to carry a double role, beeing used as a commoditity and as money.

7.) Silver cannot be manipulated, regulated and confiscated as gold, since it will always be used as a commodity even when it will find a monetary role again. CB do not have silver, they can "freeze" gold but not silver.

Gru�
R.Deutsch

Goldfly (9/30/99; 1:58:57MDT - Msg ID:14951)
Bah!!

Well, if history happens tonight, I'm gonna sleep through it. I guess they just didn't like gold being below $300.

Spot $301.20

714 (9/30/99; 1:36:21MDT - Msg ID:14950)
From Gata re: investment strategy

And third, here's an interesting post tonight on an
Internet gold stock bulletin board I monitor. It refers
to Steve Kaplan's announcement Tuesday afternoon at
www.goldminingoutlook.com that he had just sold all his
gold shares, at the top of Tuesday's gold market:

"Guys like Kaplan can cost you a lot of money. He
refers to all the shorts having covered, knowing
perfectly well, but hoping you don't know, that he is
talking only about the Comex futures shorts. No one
even knows how much physical gold was shorted, borrowed
from central banks and bullion banks, all of which has
to be paid back. It must be a huge amount, as they have
managed to drive the price so low in the face of strong
fundamentals.

"Where will they get it? Not from me -- not until
they're ready to pay SERIOUS bucks for it. I don't want
to be greedy but I've waited a long time for this.

"The strategy touted to sell now and buy back cheaper
later is touted in every bull market. The purpose is to
get you to sell in panic on any pullback. They buy up
your stock and bullion; then you wait for even lower
prices, which don't come, because it's never quite low
enough; and then you wake up one morning and it's WAY
up and now you go through the agony of trying to decide
if you should buy in at the higher prices, or wait for
another pullback.

"So you get burned over and over and over, just like
you did on the way down, so they get you both ways and
you give up your profits to market manipulators.

"It takes fortitude and conviction to hold on through
pullbacks, but it is where the real money is made.

"You've already rode out the worst, and the best is yet
to come. If you don't believe that gold will go up much
higher in the long run, then you should probably get
out, stay out, and go buy some Internet stocks. I hope
this helps those in agony on whether to sell."

Please post this as seems useful.

CHRIS POWELL, Secretary
Gold Anti-Trust Action Committee Inc.

Goldfly (9/30/99; 1:15:08MDT - Msg ID:14949)
Spot on the move...

All right! It looks like London is playing our game.

Spot up from 299.20 Now $301.20

And it's taking a straight line...

Hold on....

Goldfly (9/30/99; 0:43:25MDT - Msg ID:14948)
Bonedaddy, try this on for size....
I've wanted to rewrite this song from Golden Earing in honor of the shorts, but the lyrics are too appropriate to change. I'm not to sure about the real lyrics in a couple of places, but this will do....

When the Bullet Hits the Bone

Somewhere in a lonely hotel room there's a guy starting to realize that eternal friend has turned his back on him.....

It's 2am

It's 2am, (it's 2 am)
The fear is gone, (the fear is gone)
I'm sittin' here waiting, (I'm sittin' here waiting)
The gun's still warm, (the gun's still warm)
Thinking my connection
Is tired of taking chances

Yeah, there's a storm on the loose, sirens in my head
Wrapped up in silence, all circuits are dead
Cannot decode - my whole life spins into a frenzy

{Refrain}
Help, I'm stepping into the Twilight Zone
Place is a mad-house, feels I'm being cloned
My beacon's been moved under the moon and stars
Where am I to go now that I've gone too far?
{repeat last 4 lines}
Soon you will come to know
When the bullet hits the bone
Soon you will come to know
When the bullet hits the bone

I'm fallin' down a spiral, destination unknown
Twelve o'clock's messenger, all alone
Can't get no connection, can't get through, where are you

Well the night weighs heavy on this guilty mind
This far from the border line
And when the headman comes
He knows damn well he has been cheated
And he says

{Refrain twice}

Lafisrap (9/30/99; 0:30:10MDT - Msg ID:14947)
Not everyone agrees
Here is another one from SI.

From: www.siliconinvestor.com/~wsapi/investor/reply-11375066

*************
To: heinz blasnik who wrote (68290)
From: Henry Volquardsen

Monday, Sep 27 1999 4:00PM ET
Reply # of 68404

there is no massive short position created by the CB's gold leasing. The leases are for term and will be repaid at maturity with the proceeds of mine production. For the record I've been involved with gold leases professionally
for close to two decades.
**************

Bonedaddy (9/30/99; 0:09:32MDT - Msg ID:14946)
Boys will be boys
The percentage you're paying is too high priced,
While you're living beyond all your means,
And the man in the suit has just bought a new car,
From the profit he made on your dreams,
But today you just read that the man was shot dead,
By a gun that didn't make any noise,
But it wasn't the bullet that laid him to rest,
Was the low spark of high-heeled boys

From Traffic, November 1971

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