ARCHIVED DISCUSSION FROM 6/29/2005
All times are U.S. Mountain Time
(Yesterday's Discussion.)
Smeagol
(06/29/05; 23:14:31MT - usagold.com msg#: 133648)
Thank you Sssir Pritcho...
...for the heads up!
As always, It will go, or remain, where It wants to! ;-)
We thinks we hear Houndses in the disstance...
S.
PRITCHO
(06/29/05; 22:02:16MT - usagold.com msg#: 133647)
MORE INFO ON "AIR " - -
Those who are interested & who want a bit of a laugh should check out the following two recent GOLD articles at their site.You'll have to cut & paste :
http://www.aireview.com/index.php?act=view&catid=5&id=2055
A TWO PRONGED VIEW ON GOLD THIS YEAR (June 14th 2005)
http://www.aireview.com/index.php?act=view&catid=5&id=1891
HAS THE GOLD PRICE FALL BEGUN (May 16th 2005)
BOTH stories use guesses/comments from Australias biggest Bank - -The Commonwealth Bank as the basis for their "story" - - HA HA HA
** This site is for novelty value only!
PRITCHO
(06/29/05; 21:15:33MT - usagold.com msg#: 133646)
@SMEAGOL - - - - RE Australasian Investment Review – (AIR)
For a short time I received their "Free" Emails -BUT soon noticed a decided Anti Gold bias.They are IMHO a "tool" of the large Brokers & definately no friends of Gold. On occassions they run articles supposedly about GOLD but always with very mixed messages.I dropped them a email on that point & the reply from their editor confirmed my thoughts. I don't like them :)
PS - -I'm not too sure about Gartman either for what it's worth.
Smeagol
(06/29/05; 20:43:57MT - usagold.com msg#: 133645)
Eh, what's this, precious?
Ssir Bulldog - "I think I know why most of the familiar posters are not posting--our day is arriving. For most of us, this is a time of quiet accumulation."
hmmm, then we sees this... linked from the GE casstle (full text):
"The Mysterious Gold Order
June 29 2005 - Australasian Investment Review – (AIR)
In an environment wherein central banks are believed to be increasingly reluctant to continue piling up additional USD and euro assets –because of overly documented shaky fundamentals behind both currencies- gold should thrive.
But will it?
Renowned US based investment guru Dennis Gartman reported an intriguing long call option trade in his newsletter last week that is believed large enough to change the course of trade for the precious metal. According to Gartman, the existence of the call has been confirmed by two "very good" sources that he has no reason to doubt.
The report states that the size of the option trade, which is believed to be a long call position with a strike at US$450/oz, is so large that that will serve as a "siren call" for gold over the next several weeks.
Stay tuned?
Copyright Australasian Investment Review."
Anyone know anything about this?
S.
TownCrier
(06/29/05; 20:27:20MT - usagold.com msg#: 133644)
Gold production expected to decline in Zimbabwe
http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/200506/30/eng20050630_193181.html
June 30, 2005 -- Zimbabwe's gold production is expected to decline (26%) from 21,330 kg last year to an estimated 15, 869 kg this year owing to persistent foreign currency shortages, high inflation and low Zimbabwean dollar prices.
...mineral economist Dany Matyanga said large-scale gold producers were also being affected by the shortage of foreign currency.
"The increase in costs have forced most gold producers to take the option of being paid in Zimbabwean dollar, giving up their foreign currency entitlement. This has literally shut the door for them in terms of acquiring imported inputs," he said.
According to latest Reserve Bank of Zimbabwe figures, the mining sector contributes 35 percent to total foreign currency earnings, with gold being the highest foreign currency earner as a single commodity.
^-----(from url)----^
Evidence of an IMS badly in need of overhaul.
R.
Bulldog
(06/29/05; 19:45:25MT - usagold.com msg#: 133643)
Pritcho - richard russell
I agree, you can take that octogenarian's advice to the bank or your favorite coin dealer. In these times of so many financial instruments, my peanut sized brain can only appreciate value and I find that in undervalued gold and silver. I participated in two gold mining ventures and it broke my heart and most of my bank account. Today you can drop $450 for a deer guard for your pickup truck. I have a hard time rationalizing that an ounce of gold is equivalent. I think I know why most of the familiar posters are not posting--our day is arriving. For most of us, this is a time of quiet accumulation.
PRITCHO
(06/29/05; 19:12:09MT - usagold.com msg#: 133642)
RICHARD RUSSELL'S LATEST COMMENTS - - -
http://www.dowtheoryletters.com/DTLOL.nsf
NB - I regard RR as a true blue patriotic American & a well respected,widely listened to forcaster of World Financial Matters. That said the snip below has not been patched together OR taken out of context.Its how he introduced Todays Comments (Explanation for those that might be horrified at his comments). The finish is GOLDEN!
-----------------------------------------------------------
June 29, 2005 -- I listened to the President's speech last night. It was just a re-run. We're all safer because Iraq is on its way to becoming a democracy. We've got to "stay the course" and there's no timetable for a pull-out. Yawn.
I had hoped that Bush would not repeat the big lie -- that Iraq had something to do with 9/11. But Bush couldn't resist, he told the big lie -- again.
As usual, the Prez spoke before the military. He always speaks before the military. I dare him to speak at a big University such as NYU, Boston College, Michigan or Washington. How about Berkeley? Actually, Mr. Bush would do well to avoid the state of California all together.
OK, let's get serious. We can start with the US dollar. It's been strong. It's at an eight month high against the yen. And since March it's been outperforming the euro. But with a stronger dollar, US export become more expensive for our overseas friends to buy. Which means that our huge trade deficit will probably worsen. Actually, the US current account deficit (which includes all transactions including trade) is pushing a negative eight to nine hundred billion dollars a year. That would be at least 6.4% of GDP. Ordinarily, that would put the dollar under pressure.
But so far foreign exchange traders are treating the US dollar as the least-rotten of the three major currencies. A sad commentary, but unfortunately it's true. There's no base, no definition for any paper currency. They simply float against each other. What's a dollar worth? A dollar is worth so many yen, a yen is worth so many euros, a euro will buy so many dollars.
Technically, the euro appears to be "sold out" and trying to establish a base, as we can see via the chart below. RSI, after registering oversold in mid-June, has been rising, and the histograms are above zero. The euro is trying to avoid a new low. If it can, we should soon see some a rally in the euro and a lower dollar.
The Fed will almost surely raise short rates another quarter of a percent tomorrow or Friday. Normally, this would help the dollar, while at the same time Europe is thinking of lowering rates. But the market has probably discounted any Fed Funds boost, so I don't think rising short rates in the US will be a factor in strengthening the dollar.
It's a story sad but true, so I'll repeat it -- all currencies will, over time, lose value in terms of gold.
mikal
(06/29/05; 18:55:54MT - usagold.com msg#: 133641)
@Goldilox
Very good points regarding social stability. "Breakdowns"
don't need to be dramatic, especially with controlled media.
Employment health has been breaking down for years and despite new outlets for disenfrachised youth and adults such as cable and video games, many regions experience more of the violent crimes. What's worse, many vent their anger at those better off, and submit "socialist equalization" as the solution. This is how welfare and social security started on the road to disaster.
Social and costs are joining with derivatives and distortions and dislocations. A storm front. Epic turbulence. It's so sad here in just one city and it's suburbs. But we can take advantage of the opportunities in any situation and be grateful for having so much.
Goldilox
(06/29/05; 18:24:33MT - usagold.com msg#: 133640)
U people
@ $ Bill,
Obviously not to the same extent, but while we have been suffering with the "Lost Boy Scout" in MN, and the wayward party girl in Aruba as headline stories, there have been at least four freeway rage shootings in LA this June that barely made the LA Times, much less vidiot coverage.
Methinks the reporters here in the US of A don't wanna "touch" any local deterioration stories either.
As estimates of "real unemployment", those that include the "under-utilized", are reaching 1930 levels (around 20%), I expect a long, hot "summer in the city" this year.
Dollar Bill
(06/29/05; 18:12:52MT - usagold.com msg#: 133639)
.,.
TownCrier, It helps if you have 166 million -untouchables- at the bottom of your society. Upper castes use them as slaves.
National geographic last year did a story on the -U- people.
Repression of those people is to the extent that reporters dont even go out to report the routine burning of -U- huts with the people inside. Editors only send out the reporters when it is a -massacre-. The National Geo. staff would see -daily- reports of -U- people having acid thrown in thier face. When the -U- people get uppity, or complain when they are not paid even the slave wage, they get beat by gangs.
You got to love that law of reincarnation!
You are born an untouchable? That is it! No redemption in this life, no chance your kids or grandkids ect will not be -U- people, and, your only hope, is that the law of reincarnation, puts you in a different caste.......next time......if there IS a next time........and you dont know.......you might have earned ant or rat status in your next life. Buddha claimed there is no god, which means, there is not even any logic as to why you should behave for this Law of reincarnation, because how does the -unconcious oneness- even know your good or bad, and, how did this -unconcious oneness- wake up to build the law anyway?
And if it is unconcious, why would it care about castes, ect ect. Anyway, most slave owners around the world probably didnt have such a fancy dogma as an excuse to own thier slaves. But most slave owners around the globe managed to blame god for thier behaviour.......sheesh.
Goldilox
(06/29/05; 18:02:07MT - usagold.com msg#: 133638)
FSO Market Wrap - Hartman
http://www.financialsense.com/Market/wrapup.htm
snip:
By the end of today's trading the Dow Industrials fell 31 points to 10,374 and the NASDAQ Composite was down one point to close at 2,068. The broader market didn't do much today, but I found the precious metals mining stocks of particular interest. July silver settled at $7.057, down $.039, and August gold settled at $438.60 for a gain of only 90 cents, but look at the mining stocks as measured by the gold indices. The HUI (unhedged miners) added 8.68 to 203.10, a gain of 4.5% and the XAU (with some big hedgers) added 3.45 to 94.55, a gain of 3.8%. With any decent follow-through tomorrow, the stocks are telling us the correction in the metals is nearly complete. Keep an eye on the HUI/Gold ratio, as a breakout in the ratio can act as an early head's-up for a breakout in the metal. Continuing turmoil in the dollar, euro and yen will bode well for gold through the second half of the year . . .
Frankly, the only real conundrum we all truly face is money itself. What is money? What characteristics does good and honest money have compared to the fiat money we use today? We try to value assets in terms of how much money things cost, but the value of money keeps changing. Are prices really moving higher, or are the fiat monies around the globe falling in value? We are not going to get a handle on the stock, bond and commodity markets until we get a better idea of how much money is going to cost around the globe, and how much more money governments around the world decide to create out of thin air. Ask yourself if understated inflation is a hidden cost to holding U.S. dollars, or any other fiat money for that matter. What is money? How do we put a value on money? We all want more of it, but very few people are able to define money and the characteristics it must poses to be considered honest money. Which money is the best one? You make the call!!! When you figure it out, go buy the best money!
Survivor
(06/29/05; 16:39:05MT - usagold.com msg#: 133637)
An Interesting Relationship . . .
*IF* the POG is truly a manipulated indicator, and *IF* AG really watches the POG for guidance, then we have intellectual dependencies within the Fed that are even more twisted than we suspected.
Just a thought.
- Survivor
Goldilox
(06/29/05; 16:30:45MT - usagold.com msg#: 133636)
Just Desserts?
http://urbansurvival.com/week.htm
snip:
A movement has started to install something called the Liberty Hotel on grounds of the home of one US Supreme Court justice who voted to allowed corporatists to take over private land for corporate expansion. Here's the news release:
Press Release For Release Monday, June 27 to New Hampshire media For Release Tuesday, June 28 to all other media
Weare, New Hampshire (PRWEB) Could a hotel be built on the land owned by Supreme Court Justice David H. Souter? A new ruling by the Supreme Court which was supported by Justice Souter himself itself might allow it. A private developer is seeking to use this very law to build a hotel on Souter's land.
Justice Souter's vote in the "Kelo vs. City of New London" decision allows city governments to take land from one private owner and give it to another if the government will generate greater tax revenue or other economic benefits when the land is developed by the new owner.
On Monday June 27, Logan Darrow Clements, faxed a request to Chip Meany the code enforcement officer of the Towne of Weare, New Hampshire seeking to start the application process to build a hotel on 34 Cilley Hill Road. This is the present location of Mr. Souter's home.
Clements, CEO of Freestar Media, LLC, points out that the City of Weare will certainly gain greater tax revenue and economic benefits with a hotel on 34 Cilley Hill Road than allowing Mr. Souter to own the land.
The proposed development, called "The Lost Liberty Hotel" will feature the "Just Desserts Café" and include a museum, open to the public, featuring a permanent exhibit on the loss of freedom in America. Instead of a Gideon's Bible each guest will receive a free copy of Ayn Rand's novel "Atlas Shrugged."
Clements indicated that the hotel must be built on this particular piece of land because it is a unique site being the home of someone largely responsible for destroying property rights for all Americans.
"This is not a prank" said Clements, "The Towne of Weare has five people on the Board of Selectmen. If three of them vote to use the power of eminent domain to take this land from Mr. Souter we can begin our hotel development."
Clements' plan is to raise investment capital from wealthy pro-liberty investors and draw up architectural plans. These plans would then be used to raise investment capital for the project. Clements hopes that regular customers of the hotel might include supporters of the Institute For Justice and participants in the Free State Project among others.
-Goldilox
Hurrah! I sent an email to both of Senators suggesting that politicians beach homes might be a target for just such takeovers. Looks like I was not alone in that idea.
TownCrier
(06/29/05; 14:32:27MT - usagold.com msg#: 133635)
Indian economy will overtake China's in long run
http://www.financialexpress.com/fe_full_story.php?content_id=95171
WASHINGTON, JUNE 29: In the long run, India will overtake China in economic growth owing to home-grown entrepreneurship, stronger infrastructure to support private enterprise and companies which compete internationally with global firms, a media report has claimed.
The report, written by Yasheng Huang, associate professor at the Sloan School of Management at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, and Tarun Khanna, a professor at Harvard Business School, stated that India was superior in utilising its resources, thus contributing to economic performance.
"The real issue is not where China and India are today but where they will be tomorrow. The answer will be determined in large measure by how well both countries utilise their resources, and on this score, India is doing a superior job," the duo said...
"What is the fastest route to economic development? Welcome Foreign Direct Investment, says China, and most policy experts agree. But a comparison with long-time laggard India suggests that FDI is not the only path to prosperity. Indeed, India's home-grown entrepreneurs may give it a long-term advantage over China hamstrung by inefficient banks and capital markets," they argued.
They said the ubiquitous 'made in China' label in everything from shoes to garments to toys and electronics, in a major department store obscured an important point: few of these products are made by indigenous Chinese companies.
"You would be hard-pressed to find a single home-grown Chinese firm that operates on a global scale and markets its own products abroad. That is because China's export-led manufacturing boom is largely a creation of FDI, which effectively serves as a substitute for domestic entrepreneurship," they said. The duo stressed that India provided a more 'nurturing environment' for domestic business, thus spawning a number of companies that now compete internationally with the best that Europe and the US have to offer.
...India has also developed much stronger infrastructure to support private enterprise. Its capital markets operate with greater efficiency and transparency than that of China. Its legal system, while not without flaws, is considerably more advanced, the two argued.
Mr Huang and Mr Khanna also contrasted India's 'increasingly building from the ground up' to China's pursuit of a 'top-down approach' for economic growth. "India is a democracy and China is not," they said.
[...contributing factors which] "may enable it to catch up with, and perhaps even overtake China," the two experts felt.
^----(see full article at url)----^
This is a good follow up to yesterday's discussion, especially in light of the favorable gold-owning predispositions of these cultures as they carve out a greater share of worldly wealth and influence.
To ensure your own share of empowerment, be sure to carve out your own stake in tangibles, including especially gold -- universally accepted, liquid, respected.
Call USAGOLD-Centennial to discuss prices and a strategy of ownership that's right for you.
1-800-869-5115 Extension 100
R.
Goldilox
(06/29/05; 14:29:09MT - usagold.com msg#: 133634)
Excess sons
@ $ Bill,
During my time in University, it seemed that a disproportionate number of oil-rich Middle Easerners were hanging around US campuses looking for American trophy wives to take home. Given the numbers you submitted, I wonder if the same is now true for mateless Asian nouveau riche?
Goldilox
(06/29/05; 14:22:12MT - usagold.com msg#: 133633)
HUI watch
The HUI closed at 203.1, up 8.68 % today. The PM action either inspired mining equity demand, or vice-versa, but the 30 point DOW erosion certainly inspired more than proportional interest in the PM sector.
Tomorrow's FED statement should be interesting, given the Bear Stern analyst's earlier remark that FED neutrality can best be measured by Gold demand.
Dollar Bill
(06/29/05; 14:18:50MT - usagold.com msg#: 133632)
.,.
http://chronicle.com/free/v50/i34/34a01401.htm
Here is a link to a report on the MIT report. Another link shows the info I posted from that same book. I didnt find the exact link in 1 minutes effort.
Dollar Bill
(6/29/05; 14:14:24MT - usagold.com msg#: 133631)
.,.
Goldilox, it is an MIT report.
I did post it about 18 months ago. December I believe. google should find it.
USAGOLD Daily Market Report
(6/29/05; 14:09:28MT - usagold.com msg#: 133630)
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http://www.usagold.com/DailyQuotes.html
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June 29 (from MarketWatch) -- Gold futures closed higher Wednesday for the first time in four sessions, lifting key indexes for the sector to multiweek highs.
COMEX August gold contracts climbed 90 cents to end at $438.60.
Gold lost $5.50 in the prior three sessions. "The metal has since recovered with bargain-hunter interest being seen from [Commodity Exchange] traders," said James Moore, analyst at TheBullionDesk.com, in an e-mail update.
"Further consolidation is still likely with the dollar holding firm and oil prices easing." Then again, "further tightness in the oil sector could prompt those looking for an anti-inflationary investment to enter the gold market," added Moore.
Traders also are wary of an expected change to U.S. interest rates. The Federal Reserve, which will wrap up a two-day meeting on Thursday, is expected to raise U.S. rates to 3.25% from 3%.
Seasonally, gold "usually 'peaks out' right about here," said John Stafford, editor of Stafford's Investment Strategy Letter. If the precious metal stops "at or near the old highs, we should see a normal summer decline/correction," he added.
But if it "blows right through them, we may have a 'short squeeze' that would take gold $30-plus higher."
Either way, "$500 is the real target ... regardless of the timing," said Stafford.
Dale Doelling, chief market technician at Trend In Commodities believes that overall, gold market is headed for higher ground.
"I'm sticking with my opinion that gold will be at $500-plus sometime in 2005," he said.
Doelling expects the euro "to hold [the] lows from last August and ... it's trying hard to form a base here."
That should "give gold all the impetus it needs to hit my target," he added.
----(see url for full news, 24-hr newswire, market quotes)----
TownCrier
(6/29/05; 12:15:33MT - usagold.com msg#: 133629)
Sifting out the gold nuggest from the surrounding piles of trash
http://www.mineweb.net/columns/curve_ball/456354.htm
29-JUN-05, JOHANNESBURG (Mineweb.com) -- For generations, consumers (who are educated, of course, to save and invest) have been bombarded by a persistent series of "new generation" products by investment professionals. Each new set, it seems, has a plethora of wonderful new bells and whistles.
A new rash of products has hit the "shelves" during nearly four years of investment scandals, with the December, 2001 bankruptcy of Houston-based Enron at one end, and the South African pension fund adjudicator at the other.
However, investors may be forgiven if the idea of trash comes to mind in evaluating the so-called new generation of products. These may be the most confusing ever known, ranging from hedge funds and derivatives to split-capital investment trusts (SPLITS) and structured capital at risk products (SCARPS).
In a recent discussion paper, "Wider-range Retail Investment Products - Consumer protection in a rapidly changing world" the UK's Financial Services Authority (FSA) says it is focusing on "the growth in recent years of retail investment products that carry significant investment risk."
The 42-page paper also touches on the complexity of products from the perspective of the consumer, and changes in international regulation currently occurring. The FSA points out that while investment products can be created in a number of forms, three main classifications may be identified.
Collective investment schemes (CIS) sweep up arrangements that amount to pooled investment vehicles that are not corporate in nature. CIS includes, for example, vehicles such as unit trusts, open-ended investment companies and partnerships...
Second, listed companies, which may include investment companies, and other investment entities...
Third, life insurance products...
...the FSA identified 11 key risks associated with hedge funds, not least "serious market disruption and erosion of confidence."
...highlighted in particular the use by hedge funds of (1) short-selling techniques, (2) economic leverage, and (3) derivatives for investment purposes ...... such techniques could be combined and operated through a "very wide range of asset classes and investment strategies, yielding sometimes highly complex products." As such, hedge fund investment characteristics are not by any means limited to hedge funds.
^----(from url)---^
And at the end of the day, do you ever really know what you have -- that is, other than an exposure to risk of losing the value of your investment (or more, if done on margin)?
Get back to the essentials. Choose gold. Only tangibles provide the conveyance of power.
R.
Great Albino Bat
(6/29/05; 12:05:59MT - usagold.com msg#: 133628)
Must read: The Coming Anarchy - article devoted to the subject in Urbansurvival.com
http://urbansurvival.com/week.htm
This is an important article that all should read, in my opinion.
The coming anarchy implies that States are being overtaken by the social breakdown within them, and they are every day, progressively less able to maintain social order.
The bigger the State is, the less able it is to deal with the complex problems within its borders.
This points the way to the future: real money - gold and silver, or either one, or both, will be the common meeting ground for social activity. It will be the agglutinating factor in social life, as against the coming anarchy.
Real money, not paper fiat, will be what holds societies together, at whatever size - not necessarily the present size of Nation-States.
Real money will make it possible for small communities or groups of communities, to make their way peacefully in life, with a minimum of violence.
Small is coming; the anarchy may be the introduction, but cannot be a permanent state of affairs. There will be order, but in smaller groupings of societies, and the vehicle for collaboration will be SILVER AND GOLD, OR ONE OR THE OTHER, OR BOTH.
The GAB
TownCrier
(6/29/05; 11:38:41MT - usagold.com msg#: 133627)
The importance of "keeping it real" in the face of growing complexity...
http://www.forbes.com/markets/feeds/afx/2005/06/29/afx2116964.html
MOSCOW (AFX) - The integration of Russia into the WTO would be an economic 'catastrophe' for the country, said the mayor of Moscow, Yuri Lujkov.
[He] protested that Russia would have to 'stop supporting its farmers' if it joined the WTO.
^----(from url)----^
Given the importance of an affordable food supply to the world's inhabitants, the issue of gov't incentives and subsidies in this sector (as alternative to market-based alignments) becomes a very sticky item of social politics. The same could be said of our energy supply. But no matter complex the web of agreements, promises, cross-agreements and IOUs become, at the end of the day the food must be real (tangible) and the energy must be real.
To ensure your security, doesn't it make perfect sense that your savings ought to be real, too?
Choose gold. Power always resides with he who has something tangible to bargain with.
R.
Goldilox
(6/29/05; 11:16:45MT - usagold.com msg#: 133626)
China "Outlook"
@ $ Bill,
Do you have an online reference to those statistics?
TownCrier
(6/29/05; 11:06:01MT - usagold.com msg#: 133625)
Euro pops higher vs dollar on Saudi rumor
http://yahoo.reuters.com/financeQuoteCompanyNewsArticle.jhtml?duid=mtfh37285_2005-06-29_15-09-26_n29288128_newsml
NEW YORK, June 29 (Reuters) - The euro jumped steeply against the dollar on Wednesday, with U.S. based traders citing a rumor that the Saudi king may have died and talk that a big account may have bought euros.
Reuters was unable to confirm either rumor.
^-----(from url)----^
R.
Federal_Reserves
(6/29/05; 10:47:20MT - usagold.com msg#: 133624)
Political Posts
Don't see a problem as long as you can relate it to gold or the markets. For example, the site sponsor here once had an essay contest on - Is Bush good or bad for gold? Well the facts say yes, irresponsible policy makers are running up huge trade and fiscal deficits and they have an expansive interventionist foreign policy. On many things such as the housing bubble, the destruction of jobs, they have their head in the sand. They decide on a course of action first, then come up with the facts to support it.
USAGOLD / Centennial Precious Metals, Inc.
(6/29/05; 10:35:27MT - usagold.com msg#: 133623)
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