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ARCHIVED DISCUSSION FROM 6/29/1999
All times are U.S. Mountain Time
View Yesterday's Discussion.
SteveH
(06/29/99; 23:51:47MDT - Msg ID:8215)
August gold now...
$262.00, but asking $262.40, bidding $262.10.
Al Fulchino
(06/29/99; 22:24:24MDT - Msg ID:8214)
Town Crier/Dumping of Oil
TC, you said "what's wrong with us paying the cheapest price for our oil" Yes, I paraphrased.
What foreign countries can do to our national oil industry, by selling below our producer's cost, is scary. Does it seem to be anti-free market to try to stop dumping? Yes, of course it does. But I liken it to a father who comes upon his son, who is in the process of be severly beaten up in a fight. I compare the son to a very important industry. This son is pulled away from the fight.He is given temporary shelter and time to heal. Then He is admonished. Learn to compete.
This story is hard for me to reconcile because I strongly believe in the free market like I think you do. But more importantly, I believe in good will and bad will. If the alleged "dumping" did occur, then perhaps it is not done to simply compete. Perhaps, some country or group can see that
they can achieve more in terms of profits if they can just kill the competition. Perhaps too, there is the thought of compromising our will and security also. I am sure you will say "so what is wrong with better prices? Now we are paying less". I say, temporary gain. This country stands in the way of a very evil world. We must at all costs protect American industry. What this country stands for in its rule of law and freedom will be shunted aside when foreign sources control our industry.
AL
beesting
(06/29/99; 22:23:56MDT - Msg ID:8213)
To Cavan Man#8208
Your question; What do I think about confiscation of main streets hoard?
First of all it would blatantly usurp the U.S. Constitution;
Amendment IV:
The right of the people to be secure in their persons,houses,papers,and effects against unreasonable searches and SEIZURES shall not be violated etc..etc..
Second, in 1933 when Gold was confiscated,it was being used by everyone as a medium of exchange, everyone had Gold.
Today is different, we have been encouraged by most Governments in the world to collect Gold in many forms,coins tokens,bars,jewlery, art forms,the list goes on and on. So presently," UNKNOWN COLLECTORS" own about 25000 tonnes worldwide.No one really knows who these "collectors" are. As in India(read my post from last night) Governments and banks might try to entice citizens to turn in their Gold in many different ways, but if you read the article from last night it seems the bankers were disappointed with the amount of Gold that was turned in.
I'm sorry Sir Caven Man, but my patriotic days are behind me and my family and loved ones come first,hence hoarding for their future as well as mine at all costs. I could go on and on about this but I have to run now, family obligation....Thank You for your question. Now give me your viewpoint on the same question......beesting
USAGOLD
(06/29/99; 20:20:24MDT - Msg ID:8212)
Farfel....
I should first of all say that the Saxton story caught my eye as well and I printed it for future study. I understand your concerns but let me allay them at least to a small degree until we can find the numbers and thereby gain a better understanding of what Mr. Saxton is proposing.
Let me first of all say that in my opinion Mr. Saxton lines up on our side of the ball and that his proposal should be considered both for what it is on the surface as well as what he might be trying to accomplish "philosophically" in behalf of all gold advocates both in our public positions with respect to the future make-up of the dollar as well as our private portfolios.
I completely concur with Mr. Saxton when he says if this sale is allowed to proceed it just opens the door to future sales proposals. We must understand that he is attempting to strike a blow against the internationalists by pushing for gold repatriation, and this "philosophical" positioning should be understood for what it is -- a stab at the heart of the International Monetary Fund. Believe me the Clinton administration will not allow this to just pass by without a throwing its main forces against it -- too bad for them Robert Rubin is headed back to the cozy confines of Wall Street while the opposing forces are gathering for this major battle.
But before you become overly concerned about the Saxton proposal, please keep in mind that if the gold is indeed returned to the contributors on a pro rata basis as it was contributed, the United States and Euroland will by far receive the bulk of this gold. I do not have easy access to the figures, and perhaps one of the other knights or ladies has kept a file on this, but I think the United States was the largest contributor by far. I think Europe would make up the next largest percentage. In both instances, I think you can be assured that the metal will not be easily dislodged once it is re-patriated. Even gold-selling, soft currency countries like Netherlands and Belgium would find it difficult to become gold sellers under the current political arrangement. Of course whatever goes back to Britain would likely be headed for the market at some point.
I think you probably know that any sale of U.S. gold would have to be approved by Congress and even Robert Rubin, and by proxy the Clinton administration, is on the record as favoring IMF sales and opposing U.S. sales. Rubin made a statement to that effect as late as a couple of days ago.
So perhaps the Saxton ploy is more prohibitive than it appears on the surface. I think he would be making a mistake though by saying the "cash from sales" would return to the contributing countries. This, of course, does nothing for us and I think it would be good if we sought clarification from Saxton's office in this regard. I don't think he really meant that though it appeared in the lead to the Reuters 6/28 story. It doesn't square with the rest of his position and for the moment I would attribute the report to the anti-gold zeal of some Reuters reporter.
If anybody has the IMF gold contribution figures in terms of percentages, I would greatly appreciate a posting.
Farfel, I understand your concern, but the above is my out- of-the-gate initial feel. You obviously bring up an important concern, but if my read is correct, you will find the gold repatriated a much better proposition for the goldmeisters than allowing it to remain in the hands of the International Monetary Fund. I would consider the repratriation of gold reserves to be the first toll of the funereal bell for the IMF. In this regard, Saxton's legislation might be considered not only timely, but politically brilliant. However, I think we should be prepared for a pull out the stops onslaught from the Clinton administration in opposition.
Peter Asher
(06/29/99; 20:10:04MDT - Msg ID:8211)
Richard
Great commentary. Sums it all up perfectly!!
SteveH
(06/29/99; 19:50:48MDT - Msg ID:8210)
richard
Gold of August snoozing at $262.30.
Richard, Oregon
(06/29/99; 19:45:24MDT - Msg ID:8209)
Ignorance / Apathy
I've read a little of the post this AM, heard a little of the news, soooo, I may be way off base here. The national debt is highest since the beginning of time, the stock market is acknowledge by most to be highly overvalued, numerous countries around the world are in extreme financial difficulty, the Fed Chairman confirms all of the above, time and time again and tells us for months that higher interest rates are coming along with a down turn in the stock market, our confessed liar of a president tells everyone we have a budget surplus and he thinks it should be spent on . . . , etc., etc., etc. No one questions any of the above and today the stock market rises to extreme. I don't get it!
There was a BC cartoon many years ago, my favorite, two guy talking . . . one says: "What's the difference between ignorance and apathy?" The other guy answers "I don't know and I don't care!"
Joe & Jane America hears all of the above and says: "I don't know and I don't care!"
Let the good times role! Time for golding!! Have a good evening everyone.
Cavan Man
(06/29/99; 19:29:15MDT - Msg ID:8208)
beesting, your "comment"
If contracts could not be covered and financial meltdown semed imminent, I suppose one solution might be confiscation of Main Street's hoard. What do you think?
Cavan Man
(06/29/99; 18:49:29MDT - Msg ID:8207)
beesting
Wall Street is attracting many like MR. Leeson. They come from the blue chip and blue blood universities. Many of these young men and women may be qualified academically but certainly not emotionally. The typical recruit comes from a household with relatively high disposable income and generally has not known hardship of any variety during their short lifetimes. These freshly minted grads belong to the silver spoon and platter brigade. IMHO, this type of personality, working in the financial nerve centers of the world, only increases the need for vigilance on the part of the prudent investor. I should know because I have just such a cousin. (Although he's a good kid)
beesting
(06/29/99; 18:00:18MDT - Msg ID:8206)
Nick Leeson-Futures Trader who bankrupted Barings Bank.
http://www.barney.co.za/jun99/leeson29.htm
News story about 32 year old Nick Leeson,his spectacular FUTURES TRADING gambles lost 1.4 billion,they brought down Barings Bank,Britains oldest bank in 1995 and sent Leeson to jail(for 4 years).
His downfall came on complex bets that the Japanese Stock market would remain stable, but the Japanese Stock market crashed after an earthquake hit the city of Kobe,Japan.
Leeson concealed his losses(thats what he went to jail for) and kept on trading,and continued losing.
He has attained celebrity status, a film titled"Rogue Trader"was released last week in London,and a book is about to be written.
Comment: What would happen if some of the larger hedgers in the futures markets(Gold mines)couldn't cover some of their contracts due to natural disasters'striking workers,Y2K,or other problems beyond their control.Answer: financial meltdown!
Also notice in the above article how the author refers to futures trading as outright gambling,click above URL for full story........beesting
Farfel
(06/29/99; 17:54:00MDT - Msg ID:8205)
Michael, I'm Sorry But Saxton's Idea is BAD!
News Report said...
Gold has been supported this week after vice chairman of Congress' Joint Economic Committee Rep. Jim Saxton, R-N.J., said Monday he plans to introduce legislation as early as this week that would prevent the IMF from selling its gold reserves unless it sells them back to the countries
that contributed to its reserve. [an idea suggested long ago at USAGOLD!!]
Farfel Says...
Michael, if the IMF sells the gold back to the countries that contributed the metal, then MOST of those countries will likely proceed to sell it thereafter themselves.
The IMF gold sales, instead of being a ONE-STEP process, simply become a TWO-STEP process. It does NOT solve the problem!
Saxton's compromise ends up screwing gold producers...only difference between his proposed solution and the original call for the IMF gold sale is that Saxton's method delays the "screwing." Big Deal!
Therefore, I must humbly declare that your idea is NOT good. Sorry.
Sailor
(06/29/99; 17:45:01MDT - Msg ID:8204)
Was there a halt in gold trading today?
http://www.kitco.com
It looks like both gold and silver trading were halted early today.
What's going on?
TownCrier
(06/29/99; 15:31:25MDT - Msg ID:8203)
Will Y2K bug bite workers?
http://www.usatoday.com/life/cyber/tech/ctf483.htm
This seems to be a fair report with obvious biases absent. Click the link.
TownCrier
(06/29/99; 15:28:07MDT - Msg ID:8202)
Threat to UK economy from Y2000 bug
http://www.itn.co.uk/Business/bus19990628/062801bu.htm
Britian's top 1,000 firms are still at risk from the millennium bug, according to an independent report.
TownCrier
(06/29/99; 15:25:54MDT - Msg ID:8201)
COUNTDOWN TO Y2K: Businesses Not Ready For Y2K But Lawyers Are
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/1999/06/29/BU60141.DTL
"Anticipate the unavoidable and react to the failures" is the advice given in the end.
TownCrier
(06/29/99; 15:15:03MDT - Msg ID:8200)
INTERVIEW-Asia gold demand shows recovery signs
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/990629/fu.html
"Selling and buying gold is a normal practice for central banks in order to management their reserves. I am sure there are central banks who want to buy gold. But they would do so quietly," he said.
Some things are best done quietly...
TownCrier
(06/29/99; 14:39:50MDT - Msg ID:8199)
MUST READ: U.S. asked to investigate oil dumping by 4 nations
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/990629/3z.html
Read this to understand the mindset of corporations regarding international trade.
Independent American oil producers filed a petition with the U.S. government accusing Saudi Arabia, Mexico, Venezuela and Iraq of selling oil in the United States below its fair market value.
From the article: "If the countries are found guilty of dumping, sanctions could include imposing duties on imported crude, which would raise oil prices paid by U.S. refineries and most likely increase gasoline prices at the pump for consumers."
What is wrong with the cheapest goods we can get, anywhere?
TownCrier
(06/29/99; 14:28:22MDT - Msg ID:8198)
Key U.S. Republican seeks to quash IMF gold sales
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/990629/20.html
House Republican Leader Dick Armey criticized the plan as "just a way for the IMF to acquire liquidity for more mischief without being accountable."
Democrats and Republicans show their true colors on this one. Republicans describe the chances of the IMF sale as "dead in the water," but Democrats say it's too soon for many lawmakers to have decided the issue.
Gandalf the White
(06/29/99; 14:21:36MDT - Msg ID:8197)
XAU started a move near the CLOSE
XAU closed at 65.21 today, with a reversal and breaking the 65 level. As one can see, it is much more difficult to control the stocks that makeup the Gold and Silver Index (XAU) than control Spot the dog (Gold) with shorting dumps like occured today.-- Ari, the Hobbits are getting restless, and chanting, "Ari, Ari, Ari!!"
TownCrier
(06/29/99; 14:20:15MDT - Msg ID:8196)
NY Precious Metals Review
By Melanie Lovatt, Bridge News
New York--Jun 29--Aug gold ended unchanged
today at $262 per ounce after edging up to an 11-day high of $263.50.
In gold, Bill O'Neill, analyst at Merrill Lynch, noted that the close was
"disappointing" after an initial pickup in buying interest out of Asia.
Gold has also been supported by talk of growing US congressional opposition
to IMF gold reserve sales, said traders.
However, O'Neill noted that US Treasury Secretary Robert Rubin's comments
Monday that gold has lost its psychological edge as a monetary reserve
don't bode well for the market.
Gold's reaction to this negative news was nevertheless limited because
"many people have already come to that conclusion," he said.
Gold players will continue to await news from the US Federal Reserve
meeting, which continues Wednesday. Financial markets are widely expecting
a 25 basis point hike in interest rates. While a rate hike is typically
negative for gold, because it increases the cost of holding physical
assets, a 25-basis point increase has largely been discounted, O'Neill
said. Gold is unlikely to react unless the Fed "pulls a surprise," he
said.
Gold has been supported this week after vice chairman of Congress'
Joint Economic Committee Rep. Jim Saxton, R-N.J., said Monday he plans to
introduce legislation as early as this week that would prevent the IMF
from selling its gold reserves unless it sells them back to the countries
that contributed to its reserve. [an idead suggested long ago at USAGOLD!!]
Also, the World Gold Council said that Ghana's public statement today
that it wants the IMF to stop it plans to sell gold to raise funds for
debt relief is a strong signal that opposition to the plan is growing.
Ghana is the largest gold producer among the heavily indebted poor
countries, which the IMF plan is aimed to help.
--Aug gold (GCQ9) at $262, unchanged; RANGE: $263.5-261.7
(c) Copyright 1999 FWN Reprinted at USAGOLD with permission. For details please go to:
http://www.futuresource.com/internet.shtml
No further reproduction without written permission from FWN
TownCrier
(06/29/99; 14:10:06MDT - Msg ID:8195)
Countries can't devalue out of trouble-Eizenstat
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/990629/st.html
Looks like he likes the IMF.
The Scot
(06/29/99; 14:08:46MDT - Msg ID:8194)
Kitco Gold Graph ?
Did they quit trading gold early today? why does the Kitco graph go flat at 12:30? Anyone know? The Scot
CoBra(too)
(06/29/99; 14:02:58MDT - Msg ID:8193)
@Beowolf
In NTV-the German equivalent of CNBC yesterday- a guy from DG-Bank, was even more outspoken in his quote: "Why is so much money (?-paper?) wasted to find and dig up the metal, which has, absolutely no (other) use than to be buried again, mostly in subsurface vaults" and went on telling the public to sell this nonperforming metal( never - asset)since according to his charts the stuff is going to $ 200 minimum.
I just love it. The guy looked like 35 max and told the world - in NTV's gold update - sell - we're in a new era of everlasting expansion - unfortunately, he's right in terms of ever expanding money supply, PE's, and overall valuations of paper assets and - even T-bonds.
Uh, O sorry,I mean the T-B yield, only slipped to old era paradoxons, since now we know that even Rob the Ruby figures rising interest rates are good for the long term health and viability of financial markets. Rub it in Rob, we'll be just delighted to find out after you've fled the (ob)scene.
It's also good to know, Rob, that you're one of the stalwart
defenders of US gold as reserve currency, so let's sell IMF gold. The US taxpayer has only pledged 17,5% to the IMF, while, admittedly the gold component is unknown we would also wonder what's left in the subterranean vaults of the FRB in view of huge (alledged) short postions in the leasing game of gold - an euphemism of (paper) money creation (behind te scenes), next to the visible machine that (according to CNBC never stops). Obscene!
IMHO - 25 ounces of BoE to the ton will make the big impact and assures the shorts to lose even those!
TownCrier
(06/29/99; 13:52:51MDT - Msg ID:8192)
Meet Stuart Eizenstat, nominated to succeed Lawrence Summers as deputy Treasury secretary
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/990629/p5.html
Through this nomination, administration officials to mend the rocky relations between Treasury and State departments. In the past, State's greater willingness to use economic policy as a tool of foreign policy has "clashed with the decidedly free-market policies championed by Rubin and Summers."
TownCrier
(06/29/99; 13:24:57MDT - Msg ID:8191)
Retirement funds pose challenge for many Americans
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/990629/0m.html
"Fidelity, the nation's largest mutual funds complex, said its survey showed that some participants are not contributing the maximum allowed to their 401(k) plans..."
C'mon, people. Feed the machine...
Technician
(06/29/99; 11:44:50MDT - Msg ID:8190)
Crude & gold?
Jan. crude is at new contract highs. The close will be interesting.
koan
(06/29/99; 10:43:38MDT - Msg ID:8189)
silver divergence
Gold is up a hair and silver is up strongly. If silver can close above $5.19 that will be a strong closing. I Checked all the major gold and silver mining stocks - all are pretty much flat except Pan American Silver which is smoking up .85 to $8.75 Canadian. Pan american has warrants with a strike of $9.00 good until Feb 2,001. These opyions have been my main purchase last two weeks. I am now done buying. I bought options on almost all the major silver companies. We shall see - there have been so many false moves! Koan
Gandalf the White
(06/29/99; 10:30:46MDT - Msg ID:8188)
At the stroke of Noon NY time --- same ol'e
Things have not changed while I have been out from the Tableround observing the battlefield !! --- Today, I see AGAIN that the shorts arrived a noon in NY to DUMP a load on poor Spot the dog, just as Spot was starting to feel chipper again. -- Show no disparagement, gather more of the giveaway Au !! -- The tide of battle is turning, and we await Ari's final chapter.
<;-)
The Invisible Hand
(06/29/99; 09:36:09MDT - Msg ID:8187)
The Desire for Gold
I am still suffering from jet lag from three weeks spent in the Philippines. But I can't wait to post (more later if I recover from the jet lag).
In the Philippines, I realised that small gold producers have to sell all their production to the central bank and that larger producers can sell on the world market.
One guy I met pretends to have five thousand tonnes of gold in his warehouses. (Anybody from GS on the list? Contact me through MK :-) ). A banker told me that this is not impossible. I don't know.
Today's market report (I am almost forgetting to tell you how heart lifting the reading of this list was when I read the evolution of the gold price earlier this month in the Filipino newspapers) says that anyone who has suffered the consequences of a failed economy understands the value of gold.
I would take this a step further and argue that anyone who has suffered the consequences of nasty human behaviour (vis-a-vis him/her) needs a standard to guide his/her life.
I am only 37. I bought my first Maple Leaf in 1989 (when the price was just above $ 400). In those 10 years since 1989, I have never regretted that I bought that gold.
It was only last November that I learnt about the short position. Is this not great that justice will prevail? That the Invisible Hand cannot be tampered with indefinitely?
Your family and friends will tell you that gold is dead
(one guy at the Philippine central bank told me even that it was not possible to introduce a gold based currency because the weight/value in gold of a 1 (Philippine) peso coin is higher than the face value of the coin - this guy had grasped the meaning of the gold standard!),
but you you know that gold is ... money.
A = A.
USAGOLD
(06/29/99; 08:43:52MDT - Msg ID:8186)
Today's Gold Market Report: Asian Gold Demand Up Sharply!
MARKET REPORT(6/29/99): Gold slogged to higher ground this morning though the
going was difficult managing to tack another 60¢ atop yesterday's gains. At one point the
yellow was a $1.40 higher on a Reuters report out of Asia that gold demand had surged in
key countries there over the past few months.
A recovery in Asian gold demand when taken into consideration along with reports of
supply tightness at the refinery level could be welcome news to a sorely tested market. Gold
imports increased 25% in Hong Kong, 50% in Taiwan and 27% in Japan. Souteast Asia
and Indonesia also reporteded strong growth.
At the time of the Asian crisis last year, we noted that once the smoke clears in those
beleagured economies we would find a new gold market that was not likely to disappear for
generations. Those who suffered the effects of the Asian contagion, most notably the
destruction of their currencies and equities markets, would not forget the effects perhaps --
fertile ground for yellow metal demand in the years to come.
These figures are the only the first inkling of what I believe will be the strongest sector
demand growth for gold ever recorded. Some people understand the value of gold
intellectually. For others the attachment is intuitive. But for anyone who has ever suffered
the consequences of a failed economy, the desire for gold becomes a need not likely to go
unmet. We do business at CPM/USAGOLD with a number of Midwestern and Western
based German families wherein the grandparents had suffered the ill effects of the
Nightmare German Inflation and tell stories around the dinner table about what life was like
in those times. The grandchildren of those families continue to acquire gold though that
debilitating event occurred 75 years ago -- further proof of the point I'm trying to make:
Some things are never forgotten.
I will leave yesterday's report up for a few days for those who missed it. I think it delivers
a particularly important overview that I'd as like as many to read as possible.
(6/28/99) Gold showed some signs of life this morning -- at one point trading $1.20 higher
-- with investment markets across the boards girding up for this week's Federal Reserve
Open Market Committee meeting. Most market observers say the Fed will raise rates a
quarter point; some are saying a half. The decision is expected to be announced Wednesday
the day many Americans will begin making preparations for the long Fourth of July
weekend/getaway.
Subsequently, don't forget, the Bank of England steps to the plate July 6 with its first gold
auction at which many unanswered questions are likely to find at least the beginnings of
resolution. Reuters London offers this assessment of the BOE situation from Kamal Naqvi
of British based Macquarie Equities: "Prices have not fallen as low as once seemed possible
prior to the first UK 25-tonne gold auction and the market now seems more inclined to test
the upside. We are currently expecting an auction price of $265.00 per ounce but would not
be surprised if the market attempts higher in the interim."
In the 1970s when both the United States and the International Monetary Fund auctioned
gold the price rose throughout the liquidation. Many attribute the strong bidding at the sales
as the primary motivator for the bull market in gold that became one of the defining financial
events of that decade. Back to this morning's Reuters: "Traders have suggested a successful
auction could spark short covering and lift prices from near 20-year lows by flushing out
investment funds holding large short positions. Data released late on Friday by the U.S.
Commodity Futures Trading Commission put net non-commercial futures positions in
COMEX gold at nearly 8.5 million ounces short." The optimism is based on the fact that
short positions at some point need to be covered in order for the holder of that position to
reap a profit -- unless of course the holder of that position doesn't mind if the option expires
worthless. As we said in the June issue of News & Views:
This is the time of year when thoughts turn to summertime pleasures -- tying the
perfect fly, grooving the swing, getting the boat on the water, barbecues and picnics,
family and friends. Most years we encourage our friends and readers to kick back, let the
markets and world events take a back seat, and let the summer flow. This year we are
counseling caution. There is much in the wind and here's where we get back to our Five
Horsemen -- Y2K, euro introduction, the Asian contagion, the over-valued stock market
and rising oil. This is a year to put one foot in the affairs of summer, another in the
affairs of financial markets and attend to both. Judging from the discussions I have had
with Centennial clientele, most are already thinking along these lines. For those
counting on an easy, carefree summer this year, events might might shake the reverie.
In the latest News & Views, we ramble through the many issues surrounding the gold
market and give the reader a good, solid overview of what's happened in this topsy turvy
market of the last month or so. If you are looking for some short and sweet analysis as to
what is going in the gold market today from a multitude of sources, you'll like this
upcoming issue. It is a quick and interesting read. Please go to our ORDER FORM or call
Marie at 1-800-869-5115 for a Free Copy of News & Views -- our widely read monthly
newsletter -- and introductory packet on gold ownership.
Cavan Man
(06/29/99; 08:28:34MDT - Msg ID:8185)
Jason
Excellent analogy and good common cents. In your references to Sacred Scripture, I belive Gold is referred to in a metaphorical sense. There are many references to Gold in The Holy Bible. A review of these might lead one to the conclusion that The Almighty established gold and silver for purposes of sound money and economy to prevent so many of the abuses we see today. There are also many references to honest weights and measures which were established I think for the same fundamental reason. Whatever His reasons, it is not for the mind of man to know for, we cannot. I always take interpretations of Scripture with a little salt. Thanks for your fine contribution.
Technician
(06/29/99; 07:52:32MDT - Msg ID:8184)
Looks not so bad
Looks like gold is becoming more "politically in". They are even showing ads for it on Bloomberg tv. Anyway, I am very happy with my bullion coins, DROOY and for my contracts, I will just let the trend ride on a 8/16 weighted moving average closing basis). That makes the position a no-brainer. Bottom is in guys:)
TownCrier
(06/29/99; 06:57:13MDT - Msg ID:8183)
Fed Meets Today on Interest Rates
http://biz.yahoo.com/apf/990629/fed_intere_1.html
After indicating that a rate hike is already reflected in stock prices, an analyst says "now investors are thinking it's a great time to buy."
One question. Are they actually *thinking* that, or are they being told what to think?
TownCrier
(06/29/99; 06:50:19MDT - Msg ID:8182)
Fed's words may be louder than deeds for forex market
http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/990628/bcd.html
Looking for keys into the future
Aristotle
(06/29/99; 06:36:33MDT - Msg ID:8181)
Part 5--- Life on Earth: Gold and the Free Market
...continued from Aristotle (6/25/99; 18:06:45MDT - Msg ID:8073) "Part 4"
which was continued from Aristotle (6/24/99; 6:17:53MDT - Msg ID:8007) "Part 3"
which was continued from Aristotle (6/23/99; 19:56:08MDT - Msg ID:7997) "Part 2"
which was continued from Aristotle (6/20/99; 15:31:21MDT - Msg ID:7839) "Part 1" found at:
http://www.usagold.com/cpmforum/archives/2019996/default.html
Before I conclude this commentary, let me first express my gratitude to USGOLD for hosting this illuminating site, and for the tolerance I've been extended by so many here for my four long posts that up until this moment probably didn't seem germane to the topic of Gold. If you are joining this series late, I strongly suggest you first read the prior four parts which were given as necessary background. On any journey, the first few steps are the most important, and in this case they were also the most difficult--to include enough for context without drifting off-topic. This last part is easy. The task at hand is to provide an explanation of Gold's pre-eminence as a monetary asset. Gold is, in fact, Money, while the dollar and others are merely currencies--an importance difference!
I am not claiming to be offering new findings of my own. The inspiration for this series of posts originated from comments Aragorn III offered to a small group last month, and I have been challenged to render this tale into the clearest of terms suitable even for those not acquainted with Gold and worldly economics. If I have suceeded in my challenge, at the conclusion of this final part you will fully grasp how the free market has managed to provide a sophisticated asset (Gold) at a laughably minute fraction of its relative value. You will also understand how to justify to your WallStreet-enthralled loved-ones that Gold (metal, not stock) must be added to their wealth management plans. You will KNOW that Gold is Money, and will gain new respect for its "price." Although this information isn't "new," hopefully this explanation of financial operations with Gold, together with the background information of the 1970's Oil Crises will help you anticipate and conclude for yourself an outlook for events ahead, and will also help you to better understand and evaluate the important messages being presented by ANOTHER and FOA, in addition to the other worthy knights of this Table round. Knowledge is power, and with it your destiny shall be yours to decide.
[This is the intro to the concluding section, so you now know what you're in for. A proof-read of the body of the text for clarity convinced me I have some necessary modifications to make before posting. Sorry if this comes across as a teaser, but I wanted to assure anyone anticipating its arrival that is well in the works... ---Aristotle]
Canuck
(06/29/99; 05:41:40MDT - Msg ID:8180)
BOE auction & A.G
Had a thought last night as I entered into unconsiousness
after a long day at work 'fighting' the Y2K bug.
A few souls on this forum have mentioned that there is/was
an unusual precedent set by the BOE in pre-announcing
its intent to auction off some 400 mt of its gold reserve.
Was the BOE 'feeling' the reaction as to not spook markets??
Would the POG have dropped signicicantly more than $30/oz.
if the BOE had just 'done' the auction without some 60/70
days notice??
We are getting very close to what I feel is going to be a
major 'rattling of chains' in the markets. Tommorrow (and
quite possibly today), I feel, is going to be a hair raising
experience. Does anyone know when Mr. Greenspan publicly
announces the new interest rate direction?? My monies and
I am sure alot of others, are posed to move in the
direction of safety. Please comment.
Usul
(06/29/99; 01:32:05MDT - Msg ID:8179)
One of those leading financial institutions is at serious risk!
It came to pass that one day at the moneylenders' market,
a wise old gentleman who was well known in that
neighbourhood went about the people telling them:
"Listen carefully to me, friend, because your wealth is at
risk from one of these moneylenders. I can not tell you
which one, for I know not who it is. But one of this
market's moneylenders is surely at ''serious risk'' through
having conducted business imprudently."
And so, after a short time, these facts became known
throughout the market. And because the people knew
not which moneylender was bad, they would trust their
money with none. And before the sun set, any one
who had money on deposit with the moneylenders
carried away all that they could carry . And no more
would take the loan of any moneylender.
And in due course, all those moneylenders fell to poverty
through the imprudence of one and the secretive habits
of those who would advise the wise gentleman.
Beowulf
(06/29/99; 00:25:27MDT - Msg ID:8178)
What? Gold doesn't do anything but sit in vaults?
As a reply to some of these links where someone moron bankers make comments about gold just sitting in vaults not making any profit I just have to say a few things. Who said central banks are supposed to make a profit? They are supposed to hold the currency of the taxpayer plain and simple and pay off debts with the money deposited by THE TAXPAYER. I am a TAXPAYER, although I've heard paying income tax is voluntary. My taxes are to be used only to pay off the debt of this country (the US) and I am sick and tired of the Government handing it out as charity to everyone they think is needy. I do not pay taxes to a charitable institution. That is what charities are for, to give help to the needy. That is what relative and churches are for, that is what insurance is for. You say these people lost their houses to a storm or a fire? Where they insured? NO? So your going to pay for them to rebuild with my TAX MONEY? Why do I pay for insurance if someone else can have the Government pay for them to rebuild because they don't have it?
Now you say I'm not a sensitive caring citizen of this Republic because I object to your use of MY TAX MONEY to pay for them to rebuild? What about someone who smokes in bed and sets the house on fire? Should they also be given money to rebuild using MY TAX MONEY?
You say no they shouldn't? But MR. BANKER/CONGRESSMAN/SENATOR how is this different? How is it that CLINTON can help pay for the burial of a few students shot in Colorado but not for people killed in the Oklahoma Bombing? Now you reader are probably saying I'm shallow and uncaring but I'm not. I'll give money to a charity for a needy cause, but I object to my TAX MONEY being used in the same manner. I object that my TAX MONEY is used to replace houses washed away in a storm because someone was stupid enough to build on a beach, in tornado alley, or next to a river that floods annually and the owners complain they couldn't afford insurance, that's their problem not mine. I don't pay taxes so that my house or car can be replaced by the government during a storm, and I don't expect the government to rebuild it for me that's not their job.
As for Gold sitting in Central Banks not doing anything then I suggest to you MR. BANKER that it be minted into coins and used as currency, be it quarters or dimes I don't care, then your paper money may be assumed to be worth something. At least you would be able to break a paper dollar or pound or lira, whatever, into a currency worth something. That coinage would then make your paper appear to be backed by that precious metal. The only reason your gold sits in your bank is because if it was minted into coins then you would certainly see it doing something, and that would be getting up and walking across the border to another country who would appreciate it more than you. Your GOLD sits in your vault to show the world that you have collateral.
One of my favorite Science Fiction series, The Adventures of Conrad Stargard, by Leo Frankowski has a great chapter refering to just this situation MR. BANKER. Conrad, after going back in time and killing the mongol hoard before they could decimate Europe ends up with all this gold booty and fears inflation due to all the gold and silver suddenly available. His solution was to cast the gold and silver into two HUGE cubes and placed in his castles main square so nobody would question his CREDIT. I suggest to you MR. BANKER that the gold in your vault not doing anything is there so nobody questions your CREDIT, plain and simple.
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