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Welcome to the USAGOLD Gold Discussion Archives. The archives of this gold discussion forum are a treasure trove of information to educate investors about protecting their wealth through portfolio diversification with private gold ownership. The discussion forum also covers the wider issues of the past, present, and future role of gold in international monetary policy and the dynamics of the modern gold markets...   (Discussion Forum Hall of Fame) (The Gold Trail) ("Thoughts!" by ANOTHER)   The opinions posted by all guests are expressly their own and do not necessarily represent the views of the management or staff of USAGOLD - Centennial Precious Metals. The hosting of the public discussion shall therefore not be construed as an endorsement by USAGOLD - Centennial Precious Metals of any of the opinions posted here.

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ARCHIVED DISCUSSION FROM 6/22/2000
All times are U.S. Mountain Time

(Yesterday's Discussion.)

Golden Calf (06/22/00; 22:54:32MT - usagold.com msg#: 32769)
Interesting.....no?
R Powell (06/22/00; 16:20:11MT - usagold.com msg#: 32757)

Does the following remind you of anybody......

http://www.gold-eagle.com/editorials_00/dvcohen061900.html


pdeep (06/22/00; 22:52:51MT - usagold.com msg#: 32768)
Islamic Dinar
http://www.murabitun.org/documents/dinar/dinar.html
"Gold cannot be inflated by printing more of it; it cannot be devalued by government decree, and unlike paper currency it is an asset which does not depend upon anybody's promise to pay. Portability and anonymity of gold are both important, but THE MOST SIGNIFICANT FACT IS THAT GOLD IS AN ASSET THAT IS NO-ONE ELSE'S LIABILITY. All forms of paper assets: bonds, shares, and even bank deposits, are promises to repay money
borrowed. Their value is dependant upon the investor's belief that the promise will be fulfilled. As junk bonds and the Mexican peso have illustrated, a questionable promise soon loses value. Gold is not like this. A PIECE OF GOLD IS INDEPENDENT OF THE FINANCIAL SYSTEM, and its worth is underwritten by 5,000 years of human experience."

Check out the White Paer on Islamic Bimetallic Currency.


beesting (06/22/00; 22:45:42MT - usagold.com msg#: 32767)
Sir Hipplebeck,,,,,,All the ("""PAPER""")Money in the World!
http://quote.yahoo.com/m3?u
The above URL gives the exchange rates for most of the countries in the world.
Well ask yourself this, how do they arrive at these ever changing figures, and how is it calculated? Nobody yet,that I have seen on these Gold forums,has been able to give a complete and clearly understood explanation, to the financially uneducated.......ME!
Explanations have been given but they seem very complex with a lot of unknown variables.

A guess:
All the Central Banks of the world are linked together thru a secure internet system similar to what you and I are using right now.
The base adjustment rate is the current rate of the U.S. Dollar in relation to the group of 10 wealthy nations(G-10)(It was regulated by the value of Gold up till 1971).

From my stockbroker:
An on going mathematical calculation, which probably has to be done by computer,based on nations reserves of hard currency((whatever that means??)) and Gold, its international trade balance, its rate of inflation and interest rates, and the general strength of its economy.This is known as the"Floating Exchange Rate".

However, if you check some of the exchange rates at the above URL they just don't seem to make sense. I think another factor not included in my brokers explanation is population.

Anyway all these numbers which represent paper money exchanges are kept track of worldwide thru the inter-connecting computer systems of the Central Banks!

The New World Order wants to control and keep track of all the exchanges of money in the world thru the worlwide banking system, but thanks to what Sir Aragorn III msg.32195 6/12/2000 02:38 MT pointed out and Sir Aristotle reposted, there is a "FLAW" in their system.

Here it is:
The billions of poor people in the world can't get credit because they own nothing of value and can't establish credit, therefore all those people will either barter for goods and services,use cash only for goods and services,(untraceable by computer once it leaves the bank) or as their already doing in some parts of the world develop their own monatary system.Most will only be using banks on a very limited basis.
From what I've learned on these Gold forums many people in India, a country of 1 billion population,Pakistan,The Mid-East and Thailand are already using Gold in exchange for goods and services...End of these thoughts!

Addition to my last post; insert between by,,,and... IMF(The U.S.FED and friends)
A New World Order means ALL the PAPER money in the WORLD'S ""VALUE"" is CONTROLLED by The U.S FED and friends/IMF/World Bank with the BIS only acting as an accountant(CPA) between Central Banks.

Good night all....beesting.




Black Blade (06/22/00; 22:38:35MT - usagold.com msg#: 32766)
re: Leland
I read the piece on the 442nd. I always thought that anyone who had studied WWII would have certainly known about the Nessei and that they were the most decorated combat unit in the war. Of course, Billy-Bob didn't mention that it was his and billory's idol FDR that authorized the the construction American concentration camps for the incarceration americans of Asian lineage. I think that the fact that these young Americans stood up and put on the uniform under those circumstances says alot, not to mention their actions and sacrifice in combat. Of course receiving such an honor from a draft-dodging socialist almost dimishes the honor somehow. If only it could have been presented by an honorable veteran.

An aside, it is interesting to see the inventor of the internet (Al Gore) complain so about the high price of oil. In his Fairy Tale book "Earth in the Balance", he argues for a higher price of oil as a means to decrease America's use of such a bad polluting product. Gee Whizz, how times have changed when faced with reality. He should be doing cart-wheels and extoll the virtues of an America without energy. Geeeezzzz, What a Buffoon!

Chris Powell (06/22/00; 21:16:30MT - usagold.com msg#: 32765)
Are gold and GATA on the wrong side of history?
http://www.egroups.com/message/gata/495?
An exchange at GATA.


To subscribe to GATA's dispatches
by email and get them immediately so
you don't have to go look for them,
send an email to:

gata-subscribe@eGroups.com


Chris Powell (06/22/00; 21:14:38MT - usagold.com msg#: 32764)
Mining Web article about mergers
http://www.egroups.com/message/gata/494?
Mining Web article examines gold mining
company mergers.


To subscribe to GATA's dispatches
by email and get them immediately so
you don't have to go look for them,
send an email to:

gata-subscribe@eGroups.com


ORO (06/22/00; 20:59:43MT - usagold.com msg#: 32763)
Journeyman - FDR ruled by others, key events etc..
http://www.buffalo-creek-press.com/
In "The Creature" you will find a number of dispersed quotes from FDR's son, from the younger Warburg, and from many other contemporaries. Also "The Confidence Game" - for a more current view - though without the historical citations.

FDR's son was very deeply, perhaps devastatingly so, affected by his realization that his father was nothing but an actor playing the script written for him by a group of politicians and financiers.

Watch "The Manchurian Candidate" to get a feel of what's possible, and how far the power hungry will go.

Some of the technical details may be found in Dr. Walker F. Todd's work for the Fed in his working paper. The title can be found in MKs previous News and Views.

A wonderful source is the report "War and Emergency Powers" from the American Agriculture Movement, and its companion book by veterinarian Dr. Eugene Schroeder and David Schechter "War, Central Planning and Corporations.

These are available from the URL above.

The Congressional Record, 1933, pages 70+ through 90, particularly 80-83:

Pg 81 Left column
Mr. McFadden [who died mysteriously a while later] "Mr. Speaker, I regret that the membership of the House has had no opportunity to consider or read this bill."....

On the other side of the issue, On pg 82-3, on introduction of this bill:
From
Mr. Rankin "For 3 years I have been pleading for a controlled expansion of the currency to raise commodity prices and restore the purchasing power of the American people....."
Of course the first and second parts of his sentence are contradictory. He continues with an anti "money changer" rant. Many Democratic Congressmen and FDR used similar language. You see that the bankers were "punished" by having their liabilities in gold erased and their competition from gold eliminated. Just as ANOTHER is suggesting will be done again with the end of gold debt contracts.


"HR 21 A bill to reduce the gold content of the gold dollar"
Mr. McGugin "Those of us who have worked for 3 years trying to get the currency expanded have the consolation of knowing that our plan has been adopted."

In the preceding and following statements he describes what the treasury did with a $100 mil gold payment by Britain: instead of issuing it at a 40% reserve - 2.5 leverage, it was deposited at the banks who made loans and created dollar accounts backed by the gold, which was sold back to the Crown and English bankers.
His idea says that local currency need not be backed by gold redeemability, only in international trade is it necessary to retain redemption on demand. He suggested that the gold that was confiscated be taken by the government [rather than kept at the Fed, where the Congressman's previous experience shows that the gold would flow back out] and paper money not bearing interest would be issued in sufficient quantity to cover the national debt and that this money would be housed in the banks, who will have to maintain 40-50% reserves (which would consume the whole of the $20 billion currency issue which would cover the national debt).

This was obviously outside the original deal by banks and government, it was abandoned, and no pure cash was made available beyond that already issued by the Fed, which would be replaced with the new FRNs.

The greatest piece of work was done by the Special Committee on Termination of the National Emergency.
Their report: Served to US Senate Nov. 19, 1973, 93rd Congress, 1st session. Can be ordered from Congressional records office as Senate Report 93-549.



Hipplebeck (06/22/00; 20:18:07MT - usagold.com msg#: 32762)
Sir beesting
geez beesting you're scaring me.
If things have advanced this far, then what hope is there?
I can't imagine they have taken control of Russia or China or India banks, so there are some pretty powerful entities out there that aren't in the fold yet, but I'm sure they are pressing hard.
So it would seem that Mexico, South America, Indonesia and assorted others have come under the control of the NWO.
Once they get control of the banking, they are in there. Whoever controls the banking pretty much controls the nation. How could they possibly be rooted out?
I don't know about you, but I feel a dark cloud weighing heavy. No wonder these people hate anyone who stands up to them. I'm scared.


beesting (06/22/00; 19:55:17MT - usagold.com msg#: 32761)
Foreign Central Bank Ownership!
Sir Hipplebeck part of your post:

<Man I would love to know who is getting control of the world's banking industry. That has got to be
very important!!!
What do you think?
Soes anyone on the forum have any ideas about this?>

My comment:
In a previous post I made about a week ago to Sir Seirra Madre,I gave an opinion on this subject similar to this:

The third world country I recently visited just completed a milti-million dollar 6 story beautiful building complete with underground parking overlooking the ocean.All banking in the country was and is regulated from this building.

Construction Financing was most definitly from a foriegn source, most likely The World Bank or IMF. The country, after much local protesting, inforced a new value added tax(sales tax)to pay back the construction loan(S) cost. The average income is about $800-$1000 per year per family.(The Poor Are Being Made Poorer)

Now,In My Humble Opinion, when a Central Bank is built a lengthy written contract is signed by the borrowing country to the lenders.This contract would give absolute control of the banking system in the borrowing country to the holders of the(lets call it mortgage).
So, if the lenders are most likely the IMF/World Bank working in co-operation with the New York based U.S. Federal Reserve System(The people who regulate exchange rates worldwide) you can see what Mr. George Bush meant a few years ago when he talked about a New World Order.
A New World Order means ALL the PAPER money in the WORLD'S ""VALUE"" is CONTROLLED by IMF/World Bank with the BIS only acting as an accountant(CPA) between Central Banks.

Remember this is speculation I am not an insider in any capacity, only a forlorn Goldheart.....beesting.

Hipplebeck (06/22/00; 16:31:07MT - usagold.com msg#: 32760)
USUL
I just read the speech about globalism by Volker.
The part about foriegn ownership of the banks in Argentina, Mexico and Thialand and even some in Japan are very interesting to me.
Do you suppose this is happening everywhere?
Who do you suppose the foreigners are? US, Arab countries, British, German, a mix?
Man I would love to know who is getting control of the world's banking industry. That has got to be very important!!!
What do you think?
Soes anyone on the forum have any ideas about this?

Canuck (06/22/00; 16:28:45MT - usagold.com msg#: 32759)
Canadian banks under the microscope
Trading probe deepens
Investigation reaches into big banks

Theresa Tedesco, Chief Business Correspondent, with files from Michael Petrou, Barry Critchley and Susan Heinrich
National Post

Some of the country's largest brokerage firms -- most owned by the big banks -- are bracing for what could be an onslaught of disciplinary action from two of Canada's most powerful securities regulators as a result of a sweeping probe into alleged stock manipulation.

Three of the major banks -- Royal Bank of Canada, Canadian Imperial Bank of Canada and Bank of Montreal -- yesterday confirmed their involvement in an extensive six-month investigation by the Ontario Securities Commission and the Toronto Stock Exchange.

One of the areas of examination is whether stock prices were manipulated to improve the performance of investment funds using a trading practice called "high closing." The technique attempts to artificially boost the closing price of a stock at the end of the trading day and is considered by securities regulators to be a form of stock manipulation.

If the allegations of high-close trading practices are true, thousands of Canadian investors may have overpaid for stocks, or may find their investments are overvalued.

"We've been contacted by the TSE for information and we provided it," said Ian Blair, a spokesman for the Bank of Montreal. However, Mr. Blair refused to comment further, citing "OSC regulations."

Susan McDougall, a spokeswoman for CIBC, the country's largest bank, confirmed "regulatory authorities are reviewing two stock orders executed by a CIBC World Markets employee." She added the bank's head of compliance has been contacted by the regulators and is currently providing "requested information."

As the National Post first reported yesterday, regulators are probing the trading practices of at least a dozen Bay Street traders in connection with trades by the pension investment arm of the Royal Bank for possible breaches of the province's securities laws and TSE bylaws.

Royal Bank, whose pension and institutional asset investment arm RT Capital Management Inc. is the main target of the probe, issued a statement yesterday saying the bank and its subsidiaries are "co-operating fully and completely with regulatory authorities." Royal also announced its own lawyers and auditors are conducting an internal review into whether the bank's guidelines were breached. "So far the evidence suggests that there are strong policies and procedures in place for compliance," said David Moorcroft, a spokesman for Royal.

For months, traders on Bay Street have been subpoenaed and interviewed, while some senior bank and brokerage executives have received notice letters from the OSC advising them that they are being investigated for failing to supervise their employees.

The scope of the investigation is so far reaching that even some smaller firms, such as Goepel McDermid, have admitted they have also received a letter from the authorities and have been in discussions with them.

Officials at the TSE and the OSC declined to comment yesterday.

Even so, the brokerage industry is preparing for the possibility that fines, ranging from $1,000 to $50,000, and suspensions from 30 days to six months will be levied by the TSE before the end of the month. As well, the OSC is able to force suspensions, as well as force brokerages and fund managers to improve their internal compliance procedures.

RT Capital, the third-largest institutional money manager in Canada, has $28.6-billion in assets under management. The regulators are said to have been reviewing the activities of two of its senior fund managers -- Peter Larkin, a senior vice-president and chief strategist, and Gary Baker, a vice-president -- as well as a series of trades that were made by traders at a number of brokerage houses on behalf of the equity funds managed by the two men. The duo has been widely credited with RT Capital's quick ascent to the top-three ranking pension fund managers, despite the low-risk investing style touted by the firm. Senior equity trader Patrick Shea is also said to be under investigation.

As part of the same review, the OSC delivered letters to Reay Mackay, a vice-chairman of Royal Bank in charge of the bank's wealth management division; Michael Edwards, chairman of RT Capital and former governor of the TSE; Timothy Griffin, president of RT Capital; and Peter Rodriguez, a senior compliance officer at the money manager. The provincial watchdog is examining whether they properly supervised the activities of the fund managers.

High-close trading could involve a fund manager placing a buy order through a dealer just before the close of the trading at a price higher than the price throughout the day. That can dramatically influence the performance of funds because they are usually valued on closing prices. Money managers could be tempted to engage in high-close trading as a way of boosting a fund's short-term performance, which is usually measured monthly. High-close trading is most effective when practiced at the end of the month, before the performance rankings are made, when inflated prices can help attract new business to the fund.

At the same time, the provincial securities regulator is looking at whether shares have been "parked." This occurs when a stock is purchased by one broker on behalf of another and placed in the firm's accounts as a way of disguising the real ownership. This allows the fund manager to purchase the stock at a later point, usually at the end of the month, as so-called window dressing to help improve the performance of the funds.

This practice is also considered manipulative because it gives the false impression there are more investors interested in the stock. In addition, parking can be used to try to throw regulators off the scent of improper trading activity.

As part of the investigation, the OSC has been attempting to determine whether investors in RT Capital's funds were misled about the real value of their investments in a number of stocks. RT Capital's clients include some of the largest private pension plans in Canada, such as Air Canada Pension Master Trust Fund, DaimlerChrysler Canada Inc., Alcan Aluminium Ltd. and IBM Canada Ltd. It also manages money for the city of Winnipeg and the province of Newfoundland.
--------------------
From nationalpost.com





Canuck (06/22/00; 16:23:58MT - usagold.com msg#: 32758)
CRB
Bridge/CRB Current Quotes
Other Futures Markets

Bridge/CRB Index


Page snapshot Thu 22 Jun 2000 18:21 ET
Description Last Change Percent Change
Bridge CRB Index 227.08 +2.03 +0.9 %

Description Last Change Percent Change
Crude Oil 32.26 +0.07 +0.22 %
-----------------------------------------

227 and rolling boys and girls.





R Powell (06/22/00; 16:20:11MT - usagold.com msg#: 32757)
Good reading
http://www.gold-eagle.com/gold_digest_00/schultz062300.html
Just read a new article by Harry Schultz in which he states, "Just as a class action lawsuit was filed against Ashanti officers and directors, at least one big stockholder is trying to do the same to Barrick."
Has anyone heard from Mr. Farfel lately?

R Powell (06/22/00; 16:11:23MT - usagold.com msg#: 32756)
Golds Revenge site
http://www.sharelynx.net/temp/GoldsRevenge.html
Hope I got this one right, if not, it's on the gold-eagle forum. Interesting poetry.

Usul (06/22/00; 15:53:14MT - usagold.com msg#: 32755)
And finally... Paul A. Volcker: Jan. 27, 2000
http://www.bot.or.th/bothomepage/General/PressReleasesAndSpeeches/Speeches/english_version/others/paulvolcker.htm
GLOBALIZATION AND THE INTERNATIONAL FINANCIAL SYSTEM
A SPEECH BY PAUL A. VOLCKER
AT A DINNER HONORING THE 72ND BIRTHDAY OF
HIS MAJESTY KING BHUMIBOL ADULYADEJ
BANGKOK, THAILAND
JANUARY 27, 2000

"a strong central bank will command respect... That may seem a rather parochial point by an old central banker. But it is a lesson that has been taken to heart in recent years by most countries, large and small, right around the world. A world of convertible paper currencies, a world that has long since abandoned the discipline of gold, and a world in which money can move so freely, necessarily requires high confidence in its basic monetary institutions"


Usul (06/22/00; 15:46:53MT - usagold.com msg#: 32754)
Paul A. Volcker again
In November, 1998, Volcker was reported as saying:

"People have a feeling that, if Mr. Greenspan pushes the right buttons, everything comes right. Sometimes the buttons are not connected..."


SHIFTY (06/22/00; 15:45:41MT - usagold.com msg#: 32753)
NY PONZI
Nasdaq 3,936.84 + Dow 10,376.96 = 14,312.96 divide by 2 = 7156.48 Ponzi

Down 124.39

$hifty

Usul (06/22/00; 15:28:56MT - usagold.com msg#: 32752)
"Globalism... has lots of problems" - Paul A. Volcker
http://www.globalpolicy.org/globaliz/econ/volcker.htm
Note: interspersed with comments by Robin Hahnel, Global Policy Forum


Hill Billy Mitchell (06/22/00; 15:16:26MT - usagold.com msg#: 32751)
Official release
http://www.bog.frb.fed.us/releases/H15/update/

Official: Federal Reserve Statistical Release

Release Date: June 22, 2000

Rates for Wednesday, June 21, 2000

Federal funds 6.47

Treasury constant maturities:
3-month 5.81
10-year 6.11
20-year 6.32
30-year 5.96

upside-down spread FF vs long bond = (.51%)


Usul (06/22/00; 15:15:59MT - usagold.com msg#: 32750)
Paul A. Volcker Speech, Oct. 3, 1998
http://www.stern.nyu.edu/~rsmith/GFIN_Remarks.html
"What started as a blip on the radar screen in Thailand - about as far away from Washington or New York as you can get - has somehow turned into something of a financial conflagration..."

"What of the latest bit of evidence in the U.S. itself, one inscrutable, unsupervised and unregulated financial institution - an institution boasting the most elaborate models of market behavior and sophisticated advisors - - carried the possibility, by testimony of our central bank, of pulling down the financial tent.

In seeking a diagnosis for the present problem, let me make one further observation. By and large, the crisis first hit countries which, in the eyes of the market, were deemed to have exceptionally good prospects and policies.

The basic story is as old as financial capitalism itself.
Success breeds confidence and over-confidence.
Greed overcomes prudence.

Then something unexpected happens -- perhaps at home, perhaps abroad - to raise doubts. Fear becomes contagious. Individual efforts to protect ones self help spread distress. And if the excesses are wide-spread enough and the fears pervasive enough, a financial crisis becomes a true
economic crisis"


Journeyman (06/22/00; 15:09:42MT - usagold.com msg#: 32749)
A request @ORO (06/16/00; 15:10:54MT - usagold.com msg#: 32485)

Hi ORO!

In your ORO (06/16/00; 15:10:54MT - usagold.com msg#: 32485) you mentioned several books that you'd been reading/reviewing, including "The Creature From Jeckyl Island," "Payback," etc.

Later in that post you wrote:

"The fact that FDR's "New Deal" (with gold confiscation
on page 1) was put on Hoover's desk years before FDR was
a candidate - and that it was placed there by Fed officials?
That congress passed the bills that provided FDR with the
official authority to do what he had already done minutes
after inauguration (signed the plan that Hoover refused)
sight unseen (a copy was passed among a few congressmen 45
mins before the vote) 5 days after the orders were signed?"

I was wondering if some of you reading gave specific documentable clues as to the scenario(s) in the above paragraph. I've been looking for the smoking gun on that one for several years. I would greatly appreciate it if you could set me on the right track. Page numbers would be great, but I would appreciate any help you would care to give.

Thanks and high regards,
Journeyman


Leland (06/22/00; 15:03:08MT - usagold.com msg#: 32748)
Sometimes I'm Ashamed of Myself for the way I Speak About the Government...When Something Like This Happens...

Medals of Honor given
after 55 years

Thursday, June 22, 2000

By DEB RIECHMANN
The Associated Press

-- WASHINGTON

Some 55 years after World War II ended, 22
Asian-American veterans received the nation's top
honor for bravery on the battlefield. "Their motto
was 'Go for broke!' President Clinton said in a
somber White House ceremony. "They risked it all to
win it all."

Seven veterans -- one hobbling on a single crutch,
others stooped with age -- walked to the center of a
stage under a tent on the White House South Lawn
and faced the commander-in-chief. After a story
was read about their heroism, Clinton leaned over
and secured a blue ribbon around each of their
necks, the golden Medals of Honor dangling on their
chests.

"They risked their lives above and beyond the call of
duty and in doing so, they did more than defend
America," Clinton said. "In the face of painful
prejudice, they helped to define America at its best."

Relatives accepted framed medallions for the
remaining 15 Medal of Honor recipients who have
died.

All but two of the 22 veterans were members of the
100th Infantry Battalion or 442nd Regimental
Combat Team, volunteer units that saw fierce
combat and were among the most decorated units in
U.S. military history. Members of the units received
more than 18,000 individual decorations, but only one
received the Medal of Honor.

A prevailing climate of racial prejudice against
Asian-Americans during World War II prevented
them from being awarded the military's top honor,
said Sen. Daniel Akaka, D-Hawaii, who has worked
for years to get them recognized.

After Japan bombed Pearl Harbor in December
1941, Japanese-Americans in the U.S. military were
forced to surrender their weapons, Clinton said. An
executive order authorized military commanders to
force more than 100,000 Japanese-Americans onto
buses and trains and into camps where they lived in
tar-paper barracks behind barbed wire, Clinton said.

In 1942, the Army recommended against the
formation of a combat unit of Japanese-Americans
because of the "universal distrust in which they are
held," Clinton said. But a few months later, President
Franklin D. Roosevelt authorized the unit, saying
"Americanism is a matter of the mind and heart," not
race or ancestry.

The best-known of the 22 heroes is Akaka's
colleague, Sen. Daniel Inouye, D-Hawaii, who lost
his right arm in combat in Italy. After struggling to
secure the medallion around Inouye's neck, Clinton
grasped the senator's left arm and patted him on the
back.

(Bless All of Them, 55 Years Late, And Fair Use Protections Apply.)

Leigh (06/22/00; 14:48:05MT - usagold.com msg#: 32747)
Buena Fe
You know what I'd like to know? Who was involved in that phone call that "stretched the largest ocean," who held the key to ALL that transpires!

I don't know much about Volcker. Isn't he retired now, but still on the lecture circuit? FOA was quoting a speech he gave about Thailand a few months back.

The mystery continues. I look for Golds Revenge's posts every morning first thing. You're right; he livens things up for us!

Buena Fe (06/22/00; 14:37:47MT - usagold.com msg#: 32746)
(No Subject)
Leigh,
I wonder if Paul, refers all the way back to Paul Volker, the central banker who I believe helped design the present paper gold system?

Leigh (06/22/00; 14:16:53MT - usagold.com msg#: 32745)
Buena Fe
Yeah, I especially like the one where the banker threw up.

Buena Fe (06/22/00; 13:44:41MT - usagold.com msg#: 32744)
gold's revenge is God's Revenge
Leigh,
You may be right, what intrigues me is his depiction of the bankers mentality which is portrayed within his prose. They are very insightful IMHO. Time will tell.

RS (06/22/00; 13:39:35MT - usagold.com msg#: 32743)
HBM - re: USA Gold msg#: 32701
From our discussion yesterday-

Quote:
..."RS, you either have done your homework or else you have some very uncanny perception."

Sir, you have overlooked the third possibility...... that is, that upon request, the Almighty sometimes gives small gifts of insight and understanding. It is to this that I can credit my understanding of the value of gold rather than scrip.
Please do share with us the findings of your research.

Live long and be well.
-----------------------------------------------------------
USA Gold: Thank you for providing the opportunity to visit here with others who understand the value of honest money!
rs


Gandalf the White (06/22/00; 12:59:17MT - usagold.com msg#: 32742)
Evidence of COMEX Gold Manipulatiuon ?
NAW --- certainly not today in NY after 12 noon !
<;-)>>

Leigh (06/22/00; 12:58:30MT - usagold.com msg#: 32741)
Buena Fe - Golds Revenge
Do you have any idea who GR might be? He kind of reminds me of ANOTHER, so I picture him out in Middle East-land somewhere. Some of his earlier postings on gold are hauntingly beautiful. By the way, I imagined "Robert" to mean Mr. Rubin.

Buena Fe (06/22/00; 12:20:37MT - usagold.com msg#: 32740)
(No Subject)
Leigh (6/21/2000; 12:12:58MT - usagold.com msg#: 32688)
Golds Revenge
Has anyone been paying attention to Golds Revenge's messages lately? They're getting more and more ominous! He's naming names. Today "Alan" was the one crossed off the list of bankers from whom he's getting his gold back. To follow the history of his postings, do a search of "Golds Revenge" on the Kitco search engine.

VERY INTERESTING POSTER LEIGH, HE MENTIONS SIX NAMES,
JON, PETER (MUNK?), ROBERT (DE CRESPIGNY?), ROBERT, ALAN (GREENSPAN?), TONY (BLAIR?), PAUL.
DOES ANYONE HAVE ANY IDEA WHO THESE PEOPLE REALLY ARE (IF ANYBODY)? I NOTICED THAT "ABX" GAPPED LOWER ON THE 19TH, AFTER GOLD'S REVENGE SORT OF DELETED HIM FROM THE LIST. THIS ALL MAY BE JUST A BIG HOAX BUT IT ADDS A LITTLE INTIGUE TO THE OTHERWISE BORING CONDITION OF OUR SECTOR!


Buena Fe (06/22/00; 11:52:19MT - usagold.com msg#: 32739)
tensions
a real tug-o-war going on within US markets......gold/bonds/US$/bankstocks etc........can you feel the tension? moment of truth may not be far away! volatility to increase! dow is vulnerable?

Leland (06/22/00; 11:48:22MT - usagold.com msg#: 32738)
Kudos to Govenor Frank O'Bannon...
Oil&Gas Journal
Online Story (Jun 22, 2000)


Top Stories

API blames Midwest gasoline price spike on supply crunch


Washington, DC—The American Petroleum Institute Wednesday rejected the charge that
anticompetitive behavior by oil companies is behind sharp gasoline price increases in the Milwaukee
and Chicago areas (OGJ Online, June 20, 2000).

API Pres. Red Cavaney said, "Claims to the contrary are misleading the American consumer. Those
allegations do a disservice to the American taxpayer by encouraging competing investigations that
focus attention and resources away from solving very real regulatory problems."

The US Federal Trade Commission confirmed that it will investigate gasoline spikes that have pushed
Midwest retail prices over $2/gal. FTC plans to submit a report to Congress in 3-5 weeks.

Cavaney said, "During times of volatility in gasoline markets, it is not unusual for investigations of our
industry to be launched. Our record of being exonerated by those investigations is spotless.

"Time and again, our industry has been cleared of any wrongdoing in these matters, and we are
confident that this investigation will have the same results. We call on the FTC to make clear its
findings as soon as possible."

He said, "The current situation is brought about by uncoordinated, competing regulations that have
reduced refinery and distribution flexibility, raising costs and negatively impacting service to American
consumer. The American public would be well-served by government addressing these matters."

Cavaney noted that crude oil prices have risen 27% in the past 6 weeks, at the same time that industry
was required to begin marketing more-expensive Phase II reformulated gasoline in Chicago and
Milwaukee. He said the extensive use of ethanol in gasoline in the Chicago area is a contributing
factor, making it difficult to move RFG containing methyl tertiary butyl ether from adjacent areas.

Cavaney said Midwest spot prices have dropped 47¢ to $1.17/gal since June 7, and refiners have
raised their RFG production. "Things will settle out. Markets do work," he said.

Environmental Protection Agency Administrator Carol Browner said Wednesday that the wholesale
price of gasoline in the two cities has dropped 25¢/gal and asked why retail prices had not dropped
also.

Browner said EPA has not ruled out the possibility of granting marketers a waiver from selling Phase II
RFG until the supply situation eases. Cavaney said a waiver could worsen the supply situation.

Vice-Pres. Albert Gore, the Democratic Party's apparent presidential nominee, said he asked Energy
Sec. Bill Richardson and Browner to meet with Midwest governors to determine "how the federal
government can work with them to help solve this problem."

Gore charged, "Oil company profits have increased by nearly 500% in the first part of this year. These
enormous and unreasonable profits suggest that big oil is gouging American consumers."

Cavaney replied that "Last year industry was in the depths of economic straits" with oil prices at record
low levels.

In Indiana, Gov. Frank O'Bannon declared an energy emergency Tuesday and suspended the state's
10¢/gal gasoline tax for 60 days. The action will cost the state $11 million.

(Fair Use Protections Apply.)

SHIFTY (06/22/00; 11:09:26MT - usagold.com msg#: 32737)
spot price
At this rate gold will be free soon.

SHIFTY (06/22/00; 11:05:54MT - usagold.com msg#: 32736)
spot price
Give me a break!

Leland (06/22/00; 10:52:06MT - usagold.com msg#: 32735)
To Johnathan Kosares...
http://bigcharts.com/markets/indexes.asp
Having a busy day today? Hey, we're all "root'n" for ya!

Holtzman (06/22/00; 10:46:44MT - usagold.com msg#: 32734)
Beyond the Pale
Holtzman here,

To TownCrier regarding Irish inflation in (06/21/00; 14:19:36MT - usagold.com msg#: 32691), many an in-depth discussion at this roundtable has focused on inflation being an expansion of the money supply, the rise in prices being a subsequent symptom rather than the cause. Unfortunately, it has become common parlance the planet round to use the word inflation simply to mean rising prices, regardless of the cause.

What's being called inflation in Ireland at present is quite a different animal from inflation as defined here at this forum. The Euro money supply is no doubt expanding due to its ongoing adoption as a debt medium, but that's not really what's contributing to Ireland's current woes.

The effect in Ireland is somewhat akin to the man whose feet are firmly planted within a dinghy, yet whose hands are still clutching tightly to the mooring. This arrangement works fine so long as the boat is also tied tightly to the mooring. Once the boat is free to go its own way, however, the poor chap's position becomes increasingly awkward followed by quite intractable followed by the sound "glunk."

Ireland's monetary feet are now firmly planted within the Euro, over whose monetary policies Irish leaders have practically no control at all. However, Ireland's hands are still clutching tightly to UK commerce. Despite their (quite justifiable) desire to get out from under England's shadow, Irish citizens are still more comfortable purchasing UK wares than, say, Spanish.

Over the past year, from the point of view of a typical Irishman, the price of Spanish goods has not changed substantially because both nations' monetary systems have been kept in lock step via the Euro. But we in the UK are not part of Euroland yet. The Pound is still free-floating, and (relative to the Euro) it's been floating steadily upwards for the past year.

If an Irish citizen wants to quench his thirst with a proper Tennent's lager rather than that funny-tasting Guinness (wink), he finds that the cost of his imported drink has risen tremendously over the past year. Spanish beer can be had to-day for last year's prices, but it's not wanted. From Ireland's point of view, what's really inflating is the cost of continuing to buy products from outside Euroland. Canadians experience the same effect every time the Canadian dollar devalues versus the U.S. dollar.

The commonality between Ireland and the U.S., of course, is that, in both nations, politicians have no clear notion of root causes but are, as always, quick to come loudly to the aid of the supposedly wronged and so cloud the issue.

And the timing couldn't be worse. The monetary dislocation has severely complicated efforts to reconcile the two Irelands. Northern Ireland, as the fourth member of the United Kingdom, uses the British Pound. The rest of the island, the Republic of Ireland, is linked to the Euro. A great part of the hopes for peaceful resolution had lain on inter-Irish trade, but the currency mismatch is increasingly thwarting those efforts.

This is yet another reason why the UK ought, in pursuit of its own best interests, to enter into Euroland with all due haste. In the U.S., when was the last time East Virginians clamoured to reunify with West Virginia? After all, that territory was stolen from them during your Civil War. Perhaps the strongest reason why there is no present clamour is that both Virginias are simply departments within the single U.S. nation. If the same can ever be said for the Republic and Northern Ireland as peer territories within the EU, the emotional need for righting past wrongs will likewise ease.

Not that I'm at all opposed to the notion of a unified Ireland. I just don't think it would help. I'm afraid all it would do would be to make the northern Protestants, rather than the northern Catholics, into freedom fighters. I don't fit squarely into any of the politically-defined interest groups on this issue. I simply want to see the day when schoolchildren on both islands never again have to wonder if to-day is the day when a bomb will kill them as they play.

Yours,
I.V. Holtzman

PS: do Americans use the term "beyond the pale"? If so, have you ever wondered where the term came from? England's military domination of Ireland for the first half millennium centred on Dublin rather than on the north. What would nowadays be described as Dublin's suburbs was at the time called The Pale. Beyond the Pale was the Irish countryside wherein the safety of an Englishman on his own could not be assured.

Leigh (06/22/00; 10:39:50MT - usagold.com msg#: 32733)
Party On, Dudes
The car accident turned out to be a rumor. The Fed has officially denied it.

Hill Billy Mitchell (06/22/00; 09:54:54MT - usagold.com msg#: 32732)
Off color language
@ Leland (06/22/00; 08:18:43MT - usagold.com msg#: 32726)

I would like to add a comment in this area. If it is not appropriate for my grand children to read, it is not appropriate for me to read. The english language is thick and rich enough to express one's self without the use of bar room language.

HBM

PS: expletives disguised with *$@&!**% garbage could be replaced with more wholesome words also. If you cannot find the right word get out your dictionary.


Henri (06/22/00; 09:49:14MT - usagold.com msg#: 32731)
Paper gold
Go Paper gold! Go! Go Spot gold, Go!

See spot run
See paper chase spot.
Good spot!
Bad Paper!

Leigh (06/22/00; 09:37:36MT - usagold.com msg#: 32730)
Greenspan in Car Accident?
Latest news flash says Fed can't substantiate rumor right now.

USAGOLD (06/22/00; 09:30:04MT - usagold.com msg#: 32729)
Today's Gold Report: Three Monkeys
http://www.usagold.com/onlinestore/special.html
6/22/00 Indications
 Current
 Change
Gold August Comex
289.30
+1.20
Silver July Comex
4.98
+0.01
30 Yr TBond Sept CBOT
96~20
nc
Dollar Index June NYBOT
106.95
-0.07


Market Report (6/22/00) Gold popped higher this morning after a subdued night overseas. One
would have to say that gold's stubborn refusal to go down and this morning's solid show have to
do with rising oil and gasoline prices and the rampant finger pointing from all parties involved
which warns of the problem much deeper than any one of the groups involved would care to
admit. In scenes reminiscent of the worst days of the Inflationary 1970s; the leftist politicians -- Al
Gore at the top of the list -- were blaming the "gouging" oil companies; the "conservative"
politicians -- led by George Bush, Jr. -- were blaming the huge percentage of oil now being
imported in to this country; OPEC was blaming government gasoline taxes paid at the pump; and,
the oil companies were blaming OPEC pricing which has tripled over the past year or so.

I am reminded of a bronze medal that was minted during the 1970s oil crisis (which was
accompanied by stagflation and rocketing gold price) which depicted three monkeys -- one hands
over ears, the second hands over eyes, the third hand over mouth. (Hear no evil; see no evil; speak
no evil.) When you turned over the medal, it read "The oil companies, OPEC and the government
working on the energy crisis." A pamphlet accompanied the medal which put the blame not on any
of the parties but squarely where it belonged: On the loose, inflationary monetary policy of the
Federal Reserve sanctioned by the U.S. government.

Will there be dollar problem in the wake of these current events? You can bet on it.
Fundamentally, it is in anticipation of the on-coming dollar problem (based on rampant monetary
growth) that prompted OPEC to push the dollar price of oil higher in the first place. One big
difference between the 2000s and the 1970s stands out: In 1973 refinery input was 12.4 million
barrels per day of which 3.2 billion barrels were imported -- roughly 25%. In 1997, refinery input
stood at 14.6 million barrels per day and 7.99 million barrels per day came from imports -- nearly
55%.* In other words, if we were at the mercy of OPEC in 1973, we are doubly so now.

It's not so much that oil will impact the inflation rate; more precisely it has been monetary inflation
that has ignited the oil price. As oil and inflation rose, stocks went into a bear market which lasted
through most of the 1970s and into the early 1980s (people forget so easily); gold became a bull.
There were two stages to that bull market -- both were driven by investor inflationary concerns
made prominent by our weekly pilgrimages to the gas pump and the grocery store:

The first culminated in 1973 as gold neared the $200 mark (having started at $42)
-- an almost five times rise. A moderately uncomfortable recession followed
(accompanied by IMF and U.S. government gold sales policies designed to hold
down the price -- a study in official sector failure).

The second culminated in 1980 at the $875 mark (having started at roughly $100
per ounce) -- a nearly nine times rise. A deep and prolonged recession followed.
Big oil -- OPEC and the Seven Sisters oil companies (as they were called then) --
took much of the blame.

The reality was that monetary inflation of the dollar -- pushed by the politicians and the Federal
Reserve -- was responsible for the price rise in just about everything. Oil and food were simply
included in an across the board march (along with just about everything else) to higher prices.
Since that time, the OPEC nations have been willing to absorb our inflation rate. That no longer
seems to be the case -- and spoken plainly so at yesterday's OPEC meetings in Vienna.

We suggest a personal store of gold held near and dear. It could make the difference as this new
chapter in the on-going financial saga unfolds. In our view, the next stage of gold market
development will be dominated by investor presence driven by concerns over the dollar and
inflation both here and abroad.

That's it for now, fellow goldmeisters. This will be the last report this week as the next three or
four days writing allotment will be taken up with the next edition of News & Views.

Appropriately, we will leave this report up for the weekend.

*Statistical Abstract of the United States, 1998; Section #1178 "Crude Oil and Refined Products Summary
1973-1997); United States Department of Commerce; 118th edition.

URUGUAY FIVE PESO UPDATE: We are toward the end of this offering. If you have an
interest in acquiring this scarce item, we recommend quick action. Orders will be filled on a
first-come/ first-served basis. We have less than 200 coins remaining. We would like to thank you
for supporting USAGOLD and making this offer a success. Order ONLINE (please click above) or by calling
800-869-5115.




PLEASE REMEMBER: It is your purchase of gold from Centennial Precious Metals that
nourishes these pages.

Leland (06/22/00; 08:59:06MT - usagold.com msg#: 32728)
When a Computer Guru Speaks, I Listen...This (Again) From RedNeck at Vronsky's Site...
"I have not been enamored of the
winDOZE operating system (another is it DOZEs
alot - you see that freepin' hourglass icon
more than any other). Grow moss between yer
toes waiting for some response and that
hourglass to go away. And lack of stability.
The blue screen event or 'program has done
an illegal operation' dialog (with zero useful
info in it) is another overly
common occurance...

You expect to see the msg: "Your mouse pointer
has moved. Please restart Windows for change
to take effect..."

(*Colorful Language* Without Anything "Offensive", This is What our Children Should Read.)

4 Gold in SA (06/22/00; 08:36:03MT - usagold.com msg#: 32727)
Is Gold Ready to Attack $291
http://www.kitco.com/charts/livegold.html
Is Gold ready to attack the $291 resistance again?

Looks like Goldman and Morgan are having to increase the selling pressure again, suckers..

Funny how you just can't keep a good thing down!

Go Oil!

and

Go Gold!


Leland (06/22/00; 08:18:43MT - usagold.com msg#: 32726)
ALL
With her school summer vacation, I have a great-granddaughter that reads this forum
almost every day.

My apology to her and all...for any time
that I've posted anything that should not
be read by our young children.

Michael, I'll do my best...sometimes I just
forget...how young some of our readers are.

Hipplebeck (06/22/00; 08:05:07MT - usagold.com msg#: 32725)
TOPAZ BLACK BLADE
Thank you gentlemen. I am pushing for the physical.

Henri (06/22/00; 07:48:46MT - usagold.com msg#: 32724)
Topaz Msg # 32714 "Spot"
The "official" POG maintained by the BIS is $208/Troy oz. When calculating its NAV in terms of gold. Is it possible for gold to retreat to this level? Since the BIS is conservative, they would then have to lower the "official" POG further. To raise it now to $290, would affect their book balance. Perhaps GS and their ilk are trying to bankrupt the BIS on paper? They are actually a small player in gold terms. Their total capitalization is only 14 million Troy @ 25% subscribed only 3.5 million Troy.
They have in their own account as of March '99 they equivalent of 45.67 Troy per share @$208/troy. To stimulate a call on the remaining 75% I presume the POG would need to fall below $208/2 or $104/troy. Then their books would still balance. It seems that raising the "official" price of gold changes the picture more dramatically. To have their assets match subscription, the official POG would need to be raised to $407/troy. Above that, they would merely be in the position they were previously which is to generate income for their own account to obviate the need for a call on the remaining 75% of subscription outstanding. How stable is BIS? I'd say like a rock.

Black Blade (06/22/00; 07:48:37MT - usagold.com msg#: 32723)
Weekly Jobless Claims Rose Unexpectedly, Pointing To Mild Easing In Jobs Market

Thursday, June 22, 2000 08:51 AM ET


WASHINGTON -(Dow Jones)- Initial claims for unemployment benefits rose unexpectedly last week, indicating some softening in the tightest labor market in three decades.


Initial unemployment claims rose by a seasonally adjusted 5,000 to 302,000 in the week that ended June 17, partly reversing a big decline in the previous week, the Labor Department reported Thursday.


The four-week moving average of claims, which smoothes out fluctuations in the numbers, climbed to its highest level since mid-July 1999, rising by 4,250 to 300,500.


Wall Street had expected a slight decline of 1,000 initial claims last week. The modest increase in claims could boost widespread expectations that the Federal Reserve will leave short-term interest rates unchanged when it meets Tuesday and Wednesday.


The Fed has pushed its overnight federal-funds rate target six times in the last year, raising it to a nine-and-a-half-year high of 6.5%. Those increases have recently shown that a slowdown in economic growth may be taking hold. The unemployment rate rose in May to 4.1% from a 30-year low of 3.9% in April, and retail sales fell for a second month in a row. Most economists say that the slowdown is likely to stave off a further rate increase until August at the earliest.


For the week ending June 10, 37 states and territories reported an increase in unadjusted initial jobless claims, while 16 reported a decrease, Labor said. Only Texas and Kentucky, however, reported a decrease of more than 1,000. Texas said claims declined 2,398 but provided no explanation for the decline. Kentucky said claims declined by 1,356 because of fewer layoffs in the food and manufacturing industries.


Pennsylvania reported the biggest increase in claims for the June 10 week. It said claims rose 5,109 because of layoffs in such industries as construction, trade and service. California reported an increase of 4,978, which it attributed to the resumption of a five-day work week. New York reported an increase of 2,113 claims but provided no explanation for the increase.





Silverbaron (06/22/00; 07:47:34MT - usagold.com msg#: 32722)
POG - currency exchange rate correlation
http://expage.com/goldexcurrenciesdaily
Updated as of data 6/22/2000 at 9:00 a.m. EST

JCTex (06/22/00; 07:07:13MT - usagold.com msg#: 32721)
Dear Mr. Gore:
http://news.ft.com/ft/gx.cgi/ftc?pagename=View&c=Article&cid=FT3UWWSGR9C&live=true&tagid=ZZZGEKAOD0C
Your problem is with Saudi Arabia, Mexico, Canada, and Venezuela. I have placed them in order of importance so you will know where to start. The "how" seems to have eluded you, so I am simply trying to help with the "where."

Dear Mr. Gore:
As you will notice, Texaco, Exxon, etc. are not listed as a country. While they are smaller than these countries, much easier and a lot more fun to hate, and more politically correct for a left-wing radical to attack; they don't really seem to be the problem. [Please note, I do not own stock of any kind in these companies, or any other, for that matter].

Unless and until you figure out the difference, I do not think you are going to be very helpful. So, why don't you shut your damned mouth until you know WHAT you are talking about.

Black Blade (06/22/00; 06:47:55MT - usagold.com msg#: 32720)
FEDS Murder another US Citizen!
http://www.sightings.com/general2/mcfed.htm
our rulers will not be denied. Hmmmmmmm.

Black Blade (06/22/00; 06:11:26MT - usagold.com msg#: 32719)
Morning Wakeup Call! The last 24 hours - Another stalemate in the PM wars!
Source: Bridge News
Newmont Mining in pact to buy Battle Mountain Gold

New York--June 21--Newmont Mining Corp. and Battle Mountain Gold said Wednesday that the 2 U.S. gold producers have agreed to a merger transaction under which Battle Mountain will become a wholly-owned subsidiary of Newmont Mining. Each of Battle Mountain's 230 million shares of common stock and exchangeable shares will be exchanged for 0.105 share of Newmont common stock, the companies said. Newmont says BMG Phoenix, Nev., asset main merger attraction New York--June 21--Newmont Mining Corp officials said that the primary reason for its merger with fellow U.S. gold producer Battle Mountain Gold was the attraction of BMG's Phoenix project in Nevada. On a conference call to analysts, Newmont officials emphasized operational synergies, given that it will be able to process Phoenix material on its Nevada properties. (Story .21066)

Black Blade: So I guess that this means Newmont isn't interested in Kori Kollo project in Bolivia, Golden Giant in Canada, or the Crown Jewel JV project with Crown Resources in Washington. Although, the Pheonix is a nice addition, near the Fortitude deposit to the north, and the Midas to the south. A decent fit though. I would've thought that Homestake (HM) and Newmont (NEM) would be possible partners. Who knows, Placer Dome (PDG) is up higher in Europe, could be something in the wind or up in sympathy with all the recent merger news. I sure hope that none of my holdings are acquired by Barrick (ABX) though! What a disaster that would be!

THE FAR-EASTERN FRONT:

Asia Precious Metals Review: Gold hovers at $286 in thin trade

Tokyo--June 22--Another quiet trading session was seen in the spot gold market on Thursday in Asia, dealers said. Prices hovered at about U.S. $286 per ounce with thin trading volume, they said. Profit-taking continued to weigh on platinum and palladium, while some buying interest prevented platinum from tumbling sharply, the dealers said. (Story .2200)

Black Blade: Same old story, ho-hum, yawn.

THE WESTERN FRONT (Should be ALL QUIET ON THE WESTERN FRONT):

Europe Precious Metals Review: Gold anchored to $286 in thin trade

London--June 22--Gold prices shuffled along either side of a U.S. $286 per ounce path Thursday morning in subdued trading conditions, unable to press beyond the overhanging 10-day moving average around $286.70 but finding buying interest on every dip toward the $285.50 area, dealers noted. Silver slumped to a $4.90-4.95 range in an equally moribund scene, while palladium continued to show weakness and eased to five-day lows. (Story .2270)

Black Blade: This is boring! I'm going to go out and watch the grass grow!

Meanwhile, Au +$0.10 at $286.25, Ag -$0.03 at $4.93, Pd unchanged at $687.00, and Pt +$5.00 at $575.00. Oil up +$0.06 at $31.43/bbl - No inflation? No problem? Hmmmnnnnn, S&P Futures down -4.20, fair value down -1.12, indicating a slightly lower open on Wall Street at this level.



Topaz (06/22/00; 06:02:18MT - usagold.com msg#: 32718)
Global Market Cap/ Hipplebeck
......The world's entire gold sector has a stock market value of about $30-billion, about US$4-billion shy of Vivendi Universal, the entertainment and alcohol giant created through the merger of Seagram Co. Ltd. and Vivendi SA of France...... source Financial Post.

Sir Hipple:
FOA's last post inferred the FN/Gold merger worth a flutter.
Push the Physical though...and insist she does it QUICKLY!(through MK of course, pref Numismatic??)& Quietly!



Black Blade (06/22/00; 05:45:47MT - usagold.com msg#: 32717)
re: Hipplebeck
These are not recommendations, but this is a list of unhedged and very lightly hedged producers:

North America:

1. Agnico-Eagle (AEM)
2. Newmont Mining (NEM)
3. Homestake Mining (HM)
4. Franco-Nevada (T.FN)

South Africa:

1. Harmony Gold Mining (HGMCY)
2. Goldfields (GOLD)

I own HGMCY, T.FN, and NEM, among others, but do some research before investing. It's just another dimension to the game. BTW, I also own physical PMs.


Hipplebeck (06/22/00; 05:30:07MT - usagold.com msg#: 32716)
unhedged mining stock companies
I only buy physical bullion, but a friend of mine wants to take her money out of tech and put it into gold mining stocks.
I am sorry to ask, as I know it's been asked many times before, but could someone please take the time to list a few names of unhedged companies that she could look into?
I convinced her that coins are the safest way to go, but she also wants to buy some stock too.

Hipplebeck (06/22/00; 05:24:35MT - usagold.com msg#: 32715)
On LELANDS message #32711
Can anyone please explain what this means?
It sounds to me as though they want to loosen restrictions on these over the counter trades. Does anyone know what this is all about?
Do they want completely unrestricted ability to build derivatives positions?
It seems to me that derivatives are being used to lock in the future of everything, like a complex web of control over everyone's future price of everything. Is that what derivatives are all about?

Topaz (06/22/00; 02:48:27MT - usagold.com msg#: 32714)
SPOT!
www.spot-the-absolutely-dejected-barbarous-relic.com
We watch-n-wait!! This $286ish base looks like as good a "SPOT" as any to give up the Ghost.
Sooo, we cant go up- too much pain for the Morgan-Doicher-GS brigade, aaannd, we cant go down- the BIS-G's spit the Dummy, p'raps we've found "True Value" NOT!

Black Blade (06/22/00; 02:48:19MT - usagold.com msg#: 32713)
Dollar Bear Market Is Possible
http://mny.co.za/mgcurncy.nsf/Current/422568D900359CE080256905006A1BEC?OpenDocument
Article considers the potential impact from a declining dollar, etc. Old news for most on this forum, but a tidy little read anyway. Article is courtesy of theminingweb.com.

Leland (06/22/00; 01:12:40MT - usagold.com msg#: 32712)
From Vronsky's Site...An AMAZING Finding From One of His Forum Members...
Side issue about windows security/privacy options
(RedNeck)
Jun 22, 03:02

FYI - a heads up

A side issue, but one folks that may not
blindly trust officialdom needs to keep in
mind (I think this applies to a fair number
of goldbugs).

NOt being a windoze fan going in, but I
do occasionally use a company laptop on my
LAN at home for some net browsing when I am
not sitting at the Sun workstation.

It is commonly felt (with good reason, IMO)
that Windows has certain hooks and features
that are ... lets say 'friendly' to govt
intrusiveness and tracking. For example
a winDOZE Word DOC file has undocumented
header info that identifies the registration
and host info on which it was created. Like
MAC addr, winDOZE serial/registration info
etc which the user is not aware is included,
but the govt IS aware of it and knows how
to use it and DOES use it (was used to track
down someone sending a letter about hi profile
folks in govt they didnt like, as it wished
ill on said govt individuals).

This kind of branding certainly denies any
anonymity to users of these applications
from those most folks most want to maintain
anonymity from ('why worry if you got nuthin
to hide', etc, ad nauseum).

Other winDOZE related apps with propietary
formats likely have similar 'features'.

As to setting up privacy controls on your
winDOZE box or apps...

I just made a discovery about how Internet
Explorer (Internet Exploder is a better name)
behaves. Maybe this is a bug, but how it
works is ... interesting as to making certain
sites/domains be considered 'restricted'
and denied setting various user tracking
features.

As users know, you can set up individual
sites (or domains) as 'trusted' or 'restricted'.

Well, with the recent info of govt sites not
adhering to privacy policies expected of other
sites, I decided to add 'http://*.gov' to the
restricted sites on Internet Exploder (mode
is set so virtually nothing - cookies, active X,
java, etc are either denied or require an
OK response before setting the function).

As a test, I went to www.usmint.gov. It did
NOT connect as a restricted site, despite it
being so configured, but as a vanilla 'internet'
site.

I looked at the config for restricted sites
and domains, and it had entered it
as 'http://*.*.gov', which of course didnt
match. The kicker is, when I tried to
highlight it and hit remove, it disappeared
but when I hit OK, then looked at the site
list again, THE BOGUS ENTRY REMAINED. Its
presence prevents you from entering any other
.gov sites as restricted. YOU CANNOT CLEAR
IT.

Cute. This suggests you cannot use high
security settings on a gov site and expect
them to work - if you access a gov site, its
on a 'trust us' basis.

I'll see if any winDOZE gurus at work knows
where this info is saved (my forte is unix
and routers), and if it can be entered to
work properly for gov sites, or what is
going on here. It could be an honest bug
(this line of software is buggier than a
skid road cat house), but I am gonna
look into this deeper, thats fer sure.

So in the interim, if you access any govt
site, be sure to look in \windows\cookies
at the very least afterwards to see if
any fecal matter was left. Delete any
cookies deposited if you prefer they not be
left (you should check this subdir
from time to time - amazing all the tu*ds
that accumulate in there - espec from click
thru ads).

RedNeck
**********************************************

Leland (06/22/00; 00:59:57MT - usagold.com msg#: 32711)
If Anyone Ever Doubted John Crudele About the "Plunge Protection Team", This Ought to Convince Them...Whew!




Wednesday June 21 10:17 AM ET

Fed, Treasury Urge Action on
Derivatives

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. Federal Reserve Chairman
Alan Greenspan and Treasury Secretary Lawrence Summers
urged Congress on Wednesday to act quickly to overhaul U.S.
futures and derivatives laws, or face the risk of losing vital
markets to foreign competitors.

``The (Federal Reserve) Board continues to believe
that...legislation modernizing the Commodity Exchange Act is
essential,'' Greenspan said in testimony prepared for delivery to a
joint hearing of the Senate Banking and Agriculture committees.

The central bank chief did not refer to the U.S. economic
situation or to monetary policy in his testimony.

Congress is currently considering legislation that would clearly
exclude privately-negotiated, or over the counter, derivatives
from government oversight, restructure the regulation of
traditional futures exchanges and allow the trading of futures
contracts on individual stocks.

The overhaul has won broad
support from lawmakers and the
financial industry amid growing
fears that outdated regulations are
eroding traditional U.S.
dominance of lucrative futures
and derivatives markets. But it has been dogged by disputes over
the single-stock futures issue and faces an uphill battle in a
shortened, election-year congressional session.

``These provisions are vitally important to the soundness and
competitiveness of our derivatives markets in what is an
increasingly integrated and intensely competitive global
economy,'' Greenspan warned.

Summers echoed Greenspan's concerns, and urged the
lawmakers to work to pass the overhaul ``as soon as possible''.

``In the absence of an updated legal and regulatory environment,
needless systemic risk might jeopardize the broader vitality of the
American capital markets,'' Summers said in his prepared
testimony to the committees.

``We also risk an erosion of the competitiveness of American
financial markets, with an increasing amount of business moving
offshore to jurisdictions where the framework has kept up with
the pace of change,'' he added.

Derivatives are investments whose value is linked to underlying
factors such as interest rates or currency exchange rates. The
Bank for International Settlements has estimated that the total
notional amount of outstanding OTC derivatives reached $80
trillion in 1998.

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