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Welcome to the USAGOLD Gold Discussion Archives. The archives of this gold discussion forum are a treasure trove of information to educate investors about protecting their wealth through portfolio diversification with private gold ownership. The discussion forum also covers the wider issues of the past, present, and future role of gold in international monetary policy and the dynamics of the modern gold markets...

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FORUM ARCHIVES

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Archives date back to September 22, 1998

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ARCHIVED DISCUSSION FROM 9/20/2000
All times are U.S. Mountain Time

(Yesterday's Discussion.)

MarkeTalk (09/20/00; 23:24:07MT - usagold.com msg#: 37085)
Intervention to Save Euro
Did anyone read the headline article in today's edition of The Financial Times? The recent plunge in the value of the euro has people in Europe and Asia calling for some kind of concerted intervention. Michael Mussa, chief economist for the IMF, stated that unless action to prop up the euro were taken very soon the eventual snap-back rally of the euro against the U.S. dollar would be much more severe, causing unpleasant consequences. Even Ernst Welteke, president of the Bundesbank (whose picture graced the front page of today's FT), allied himself with the interventionists except he stated such intervention could not be expected until after the November presidential election. He is on record as expecting a large, corrective rally.

Now for those readers who "look beneath the covers" of politics and money, it is well known that The Financial Times is a mouthpiece of the Establishment. Today's article was sending a message that the powers-that-be want a strong dollar for a little while longer, and then BOOM! And we all know that a strong U.S. dollar has helped keep gold down. My only question is: Are they stronger than Bad Boy Saddam Hussein who is now threatening to withhold Iraq's 2.3 million barrels of oil per day from the world market? While on the surface higher oil prices seem to go hand in hand with a stronger U.S. dollar (and certainly have contributed to a stronger dollar recently), a contrived shortage by Iraq would cause fear and panic among investors by plunging stock markets around the world and most likely a run into precious metals. My bet: The Middle East players are so unpredictable that the Establishment may have met its match and that the markets are about to take control.

Final note: Did anyone listen to last Friday's radio show "Coast to Coast AM" with Shaun David Morton? This is the old Art Bell Show with a new host, Mike Siegel. IF Mr. Morton is correct about his predictions (and his track record is around 75%), then Saddam Hussein WILL cut off all Iraqi oil output and throw the world into "an economic meltdown" (to quote him). Is there any doubt that gold will shine again under these circumstances? You can visit the show's website at: www.coasttocoastam.com. Another consequence to such a catastrophe would be the defeat of Al Gore and election of George Bush as president. We certainly do live in perilous times. Any rational, thinking individual should be buying gold at these prices and under these circumstances.

Black Blade (09/20/00; 23:04:02MT - usagold.com msg#: 37084)
Risks of Forward Gold Sales
http://www.dailyreckoning.com/
The following excerpt from "The Daily Reckoning" -- Hedging (Forward sales a.k.a. Shorting your product that you have no confidence in)

Gold rose 50 cents. Gold is supposed to be a watchdog on inflation and financial excess. But this old hound seems to have gone blind and deaf. The money supply continues to rise twice as fast as the GDP... and the annual trade deficit is approaching the total of GDP growth. But nary a woof or growl out of gold.

*** Speaking of gold, reader B.G. asks: "You and other writers have been very high on Anglo Gold. After reading the comments about Barrick's hedging of their gold, I asked Anglo about their positions. Steve Lenahan, Executive Officer, Investor Relations, stated, '...on 30 June 2000, approximately 41% of five years' production was hedged out until 2009, with some 77% of that in the first five years'... Comment?"
Doug Casey responds: "Hedging production has been an excellent idea over the last decade, in that it's greatly improved returns for the companies that have done so, with the exception of a few relative newcomers to the game, like Ashanti and Cambior, who came close to bankrupting themselves on the metal's brief spike some months ago. Hedging has been especially profitable for Barrick, its originator. But, as more companies hedged, it's reduced the returns of hedging. And the longer the gold bear market has gone on, the riskier it's become. "

"Personally," Casey continues, "I'm leery about owning any company with significant hedging. The entire thing could blow up much in the manner of Long Term Capital. The whole point of owning gold stocks is to have leverage when gold goes up. If your company is hedged, it not only won't profit from higher gold prices, but may go under due to being short in a bull market. What's the point?"

Black Blade: BTW, hedge fund Barrick (ABX) hit a new 52 week low today, and Freeport-McMoRan Copper & Gold Inc. (FCX) posted a $16 million loss from liabilities related to it's hedging strategy. Yeah, hedging has done wonders for the shareholders.

Gandalf the White (09/20/00; 23:02:00MT - usagold.com msg#: 37083)
Phoenix (09/20/00; 17:34:56MT - usagold.com msg#: 37062)
Still ROFL, Peter of the House of Asher, BUT now able to Second the Nomination to the HoF !
<;-)

Gandalf the White (09/20/00; 22:52:21MT - usagold.com msg#: 37082)
****CONTEST #1*******"
MK said, "This week we celebrate our Forum's Second Birthday on September 22, 2000.
To celebrate, we hereby call all members of this illustrious and sturdy Oaken Table to a contest of posting prowess, erudition and skill (as well as a dose of good luck). There will be three separate contests and three separate awards. You can enter all three or as many as you like."

To officially enter this contest, please submit your post to the Forum with "******CONTEST #1*******" in the Subject line. All entries in this first contest must be posted by Friday, September 22, 2000, 5 pm MDT -- USAGOLD Forum's Official Birthday.

+++++++

I, Gandalf the White, a USAGOLD "Poster", keep returning to this Forum because the FORUM is my online "HOME" !!

As such, perhaps I, the Ol'e WIZ, and the Hobbits have had an opportunity to investigate the Castle nearly as much as both the Town Crier and the Castle Architect Sir Jeff. Wishing not to disagree with the Head of the Castle, I have noticed however, that some "unofficial" postings occurred earlier in the week of the FORUM's OFFICAL Birthday date. < ; - )>>

To wit: (to be hummed to the tune "THOSE WERE the DAYS"!) <;-)
=====
DISCUSSION FROM 9/19/1998
Currently viewing midnight - noon discussion | View posts from noon - midnight discussion
(Mountain Standard Time)
Post to TODAY'S Discussion.

Welcome to the USAGOLD FORUM!
The FORUM officially opened during the Noon to Midnight MST time period.
*** End of page :-)

==
Then the famous mysterious riddle of the lost 38 initial posts to the fledgling FORUM and the next OFFICIAL restart by the genial Host MK. <;- )
==

USAGOLD (9/20/98; 15:58:21 Msg ID:39)
WELCOME...........
I want to welcome all fellow goldmeisters to the USAGOLD FORUM. If you would like to post, please go to the registration page as soon as possible. I will be trying to issue passwords what's left of today and tomorrow as soon as possible to get things rolling. Let's keep it clean, have some fun, and learn a great deal from each other. I invite you to make this your headquarters for finding and disseminating gold information. I will pretty much stay out of the conversation and let this be your FORUM!. Who knows we may even have a visit soon from some old friends. Stay tuned, fellow meisters, this is going to be fun.

bmacd (9/20/98; 18:29:41 Msg ID:42)
New Week

==
Hail the FIRST REMAINING "record" of a "Poster"!
Bmacd <;- )
Quickly followed by the FIRST Double Post (#43 and #46) By non-other than FOA !! <;- )
Who knows if #'s 44 and 45 ever made it out of the web ?
==

Friend of Another (9/20/98; 19:03:15 Msg ID:43)
The Markets!
To All: It's an interesting corner that the Euro people (BIS) have put the US government and the dollar into. As the only reserve currency, the dollar must fall in value in order to reflate the world economy. But, a week dollar is exactly what the Treasury doesn't need with the upcoming Euro. Now, all Europe has to do is wait and watch as the markets do their dirty work! If the dollar stays strong, the countries in crisis will sink even lower. In doing so this will create a US trade deficit never before seen in modern times. It is no accident that most of the economies in crisis are many of the chief trading partners of America. It's also no accident that they all are IMF/Dollar advocates. Meaning, they hold little Gold and much US treasury debt as local currency reserves. The US will be forced, by deteriorating market conditions, to lower the exchange value of the dollar. But, if Greenspan lowers local interest rates, Europe will begin to dump the dollar. For them, they don't need the dollar as a reserve currency anymore! They will hold a small amount of it only as an currency exchange intervention vehicle. With this new definition for the dollar it will be required to carry a good interest rate. They have the Dollar in a trap that will force the Fed to lower it's value through the foreign exchange window. All the while pushing interest rates up or holding them steady to protect this reserve currency. This isn't a strange twist as it happened once before during the 70's. Only this time a new world reserve currency is coming online, giving many countries a choice for the first time. I think China can't wait to unload it's US treasury holdings for the Euro. I agree with Another's last post (in the archives) about the vintage wine. Gold is that reserve vintage that many people kept trying to open before it's time. By the end of the year, the currency wars will bring this fine wine to completion. Once it goes above $360 some major defaults will occur, changing the entire aspect of the market. Add to this the introduction of the Euro and the old US Dollar gold market will disappear. Some investors are buying gold for the Y2K problem. I thing the Currency Wars will destroy the markets long before Y2K does it's deed! Also, I am very excited to hear of this USAGOLD FORUM. I think myself and Another will have much participation with this new discussion group! It will, no doubt, be followed by many Gold investors. Who knows, perhaps even a Central Banker or Government leader? Thanks FOA

Friend of Another (9/20/98; 19:20:34 Msg ID:46)
The Markets!

bmacd (9/20/98; 19:30:44 Msg ID:47)
Euro

Friend of Another (9/20/98; 20:09:53 Msg ID:48)
TO BNACD:

Friend of Another (9/20/98; 20:16:24 Msg ID:49)
BMACD:
My last post was to your 18:29. Also, I somehow double posted? Because not many are here, perhaps we will talk for a while. I expect Another will send something if able. I will reply to your 19:30. Thanks

bmacd (9/20/98; 20:45:24 Msg ID:50)
To Friend of Another

Friend of Another (9/20/98; 20:48:44 Msg ID:51)
BMACD:

Friend of Another (9/20/98; 22:02:45 Msg ID:53)
BMACD
Before I continue, I want to thank Mr. Kosares for creating this Forum. This effort by USAGOLD will reward many readers with interesting discussion and debate about the future of gold in the world society. Michael, thank you!

Friend of Another (9/20/98; 22:12:19 Msg ID:54)
ALL:
To some of my friends I say good day and to others good night. Will return for more discussion and thoughts. Thanks
FOA
====
OOPS ! More problems and lost posts of 9/21/98
<;- (
====
DISCUSSION FROM 9/22/1998

ANOTHER (9/22/98; 07:36:39 Msg ID:80)
Re: Goldfly (9/21/98; 21:37:48 Msg ID:77)
Mr. Goldfly, Perhaps your question will be answered in the future we now approach. However, for today, if we place ourselves in the land of Russia at the entrance of the "once most strong bank". What price do you offer for gold to replace the lost savings account? It would seem that in the process to return a portion of your wealth, that does represent a "lifes productive efforts", any price for gold would be as "the bargain". I do admit that it is not the good position for ones family to be in, as others will also bid for this opportunity to gain gold. Tomorrow, when you and your neighbor use Euros to purchase the gasoline, a much smaller supply of gold will be divided by the dollars in existence. Few will concede that gold could be so high, as at present, "dollars price gold". But few have known a time when "Gold priced dollars"! Thank You

Goldfly (9/22/98; 09:30:52 Msg ID:81)
Gold Value

USAGOLD (9/22/98; 09:43:07 Msg ID:82)
POSTING PROBLEMS...
Seems we're experiencing technical difficulty. The technical people are looking into it. Starter Bugs, not millennium bugs.........Try shorter posts and don't forget to save it because we don't know what's going on here. Will post when its fixed.

RAINMAN (9/22/98; 10:19:25 Msg ID:83)
@ ANOTHER AND FRIEND OF ANOTHER

sniper (9/22/98; 10:48:04 Msg ID:84)
Password

ANOTHER (9/22/98; 11:15:31 Msg ID:85)
REPOST:
To all: A repost of my full (9/22/98; 07:36:39 Msg ID:80) to Goldfly. Also, my post to Mr. Aragorn is lost? Will send again if able. Goldfly (9/21/98; 21:37:48 Msg ID:77) Mr. Goldfly, Perhaps your question will be answered in the future we now approach. However, for today, if we place ourselves in the land of Russia at the entrance of the "once most strong bank". What price do you offer for gold to replace the lost savings account? It would seem that in the process to return a portion of your wealth, that does represent a "lifes productive efforts", any price for gold would be as "the bargain". I do admit that it is not the good position for ones family to be in, as others will also bid for this opportunity to gain gold. Tomorrow, when you and your neighbor use Euros to purchase the gasoline, a much smaller supply of gold will be divided by the dollars in existence. Few will concede that gold could be so high, as at present, "dollars price gold". But few have known a time when "Gold priced dollars"! Thank You

Tech (9/22/98
Sorry about tech problems
Please excuse the tech problems we have been having. The board has only been up for about 48 hours and there are still some things to resolve. Keep posting but keep in mind that there may be some problems at the start. They will get resolved. Again, my applogies for the problems. Jeff Marett (the one who put all of this together.

======
WELL, I think that you can see that the start was just like a Hobbit taking the FIRST STEPS. Lots of falls and restarts and then the pieces started to settle into place and here we are today. Thousands strong and many willing to share their thinking and viewpoints. HAPPY BIRTHDAY USAGOLD FORUM !!! AND -- Thank you again MK for believing in the concept of having a TableRound where we may all meet in kinship and share in the learning of truths ! I raise my goblet,and propose a toast --"HAIL Birthday Number #2"
< ; - )

Aristotle (09/20/00; 22:42:54MT - usagold.com msg#: 37081)
Phoenix -- nice link
The Hubbert Center! I had a meeting with Van Kirk maybe 4 years ago. I trust you know CVK? Any friend of Mines is a friend of mine.

Gold. Get you some. ---Aristotle

Peter Asher (09/20/00; 22:36:39MT - usagold.com msg#: 37080)
@ Black Blade & Phoenix
I imagine you guys will have alot to say about the following article

September 19, 2000

No Need to Panic over Oil Prices: Don't
Believe the Politicians' Rhetoric

by Jerry Taylor

Jerry Taylor is the director of natural resource studies
at the Cato Institute.

What is to be made of the dramatic, 18-month run-up of oil prices?
Despite the political Sturm und Drang, the oil price spiral is not that
hard to understand.

After hitting a modern low of $10 a barrel in 1998, demand started
back up again as Asia recovered from its financial crisis and the
European economy staggered forward. Supply was further
constrained in March 1999, when OPEC production cutbacks were
announced as a matter of economic survival. The "Big Three"
non-OPEC producers -- Mexico, Norway, and Russia -- jettisoned
their long-standing policy of maximizing production at OPEC's
expense and made a non-aggression pact with their competitors in
the cartel.

Oil companies were in no position to increase production, because
-- after hemorrhaging billions during the glut -- exploration,
development, and production budgets had been slashed. It takes time
to reverse course, and when prices began to climb again, oil
companies feared that the price recovery was only temporary. Only
now are companies taking prices seriously and putting money back
into production. But with inventories low and refinery capacity
stretched to the limit, there won't be any break in price soon without
significant change in OPEC policy.

That's the story. Now, let's dispel some fears.

First, the belief that the oil fields are running dry is nonsense. Proven
reserves (that is, oil that can tapped and marketed today at a profit)
are 15 times larger today than they were in 1948. Moreover, given
present consumption levels, the Energy Information Administration
reports that oil fields could last another 230 years before running dry
and that unconventional petroleum sources (tar sands, shale, and the
like) could meet present demands for an additional 580 years.

The key, however, is price. When prices are low, a lot of that oil
will remain in the ground. With prices at today's level, that oil
becomes highly profitable to bring to market. It takes time, but once
the industry is convinced that high prices aren't some sort of mirage,
that oil will flood the market.

Are these prices a mirage? Well, they're real enough, but they don't
reflect underlying realities about the availability of oil. Although the
Saudis are producing 8 million barrels a day at a cost of $1.50 a
barrel, they were churning out 10 million barrels a day during the
Gulf War and have the capacity to go as high as 16 million barrels a
day if they wished, at no increase in marginal cost. While it's true
that the rest of OPEC is producing at near capacity, OPEC is less a
cartel than it is one dominant market leader -- Saudi Arabia--and a
collection of moderately influential followers.

Non-OPEC producers thus face a difficult dilemma. The Saudis are
clearly capable of flooding the market at a moment's notice, driving
prices back down and making investments today unprofitable
tomorrow. To invest or not to invest is really to bet on Saudi
production behavior. Up until now, most non-OPEC producers
believed that the Saudis were simply engaged in the economic
equivalent of a drive-by shooting of oil consumers, an undertaking
made easier by the exogenous developments in the global economy
over the last few years.

The same dilemma is faced by consumers. As most any
environmental activist will tell you, we have a tremendous cupboard
of energy-efficient technologies and alternative-energy sources that
have been gathering dust because, with energy cheaper than water, it
made little sense to invest in them. If prices remain high, America
can, over the long run, shift away from oil consumption far more
quickly -- and far more dramatically -- than it could in the 1970s.
While demand for oil is inelastic in the short run, every energy
economist knows that it's quite elastic in the long run.

All this means that the Saudis -- and therefore OPEC -- can't
maintain these prices forever. Too much slack capacity exists in the
system. The trick for the Saudis is to extract what economic rents
they can without inducing major increases in non-OPEC supply or
long-term investments in energy efficiency. Either the Saudis will
break the price bubble, or non-OPEC suppliers will do it for them
-- as was the case in the great price collapse of 1986.

In the meantime, don't worry about another oil-induced recession.
Adjusting for inflation, oil prices in 1973 stood at $90 a barrel. So
we've got a long ways to go before prices approach those of the
1970s in real terms. Moreover, the economy is far less vulnerable to
oil-price shocks today. Whereas 9 percent of the GDP was spent on
oil in the 1970s, only 3 percent is so spent today. Oil prices are
simply unable to wreak the amount of havoc in today's economy that
they could in the economy of 20 years ago.

In the final analysis, there's nothing that government can do about the
underlying realities of the world oil market. Subsidies to domestic
producers are incapable of significantly diminishing Saudi Arabia's
market power, no matter what you hear from oil-state politicians. As
long as oil costs $1.50 to produce in the Persian Gulf and $7 to
produce elsewhere, OPEC's going to have plenty of short-term
market power to periodically hold up consumers if that's their wish.
Moreover, no amount of "get tough" rhetoric or "pretty please"
diplomacy has ever affected OPEC production decisions, despite
what American politicians would have you believe. Finally, "energy
independence" is no answer: Even if the U.S. imported zero oil from
the Gulf, domestic crude would rise to the international market price
because oil is a global commodity.

If government must do something, it could open up the otherwise
useless Strategic Petroleum Reserve for domestic consumption.
Energy economist Phil Verleger argues that using our "rainy day" oil
fund to combat periodic OPEC price-gouging operations is the only
sensible use of the SPR, and he's right. Tapping the SPR could bring
prices down $10 a barrel or more almost overnight. If the Saudis are
intent on using their short-term market power to periodically hold up
American consumers (a power that God gave them by putting those
dirt-cheap reserves under their sand), then using the reserve to buy
oil when it's cheap and sell oil when it's high makes eminent sense.
Moreover, it will discourage future price-gouging episodes by taking
some of the profit out of them.

Otherwise, politicians should stay out of the market's way.

This essay originally appeared on National Review Online on Sept. 7. Copyright
National Review 2000.

� 2000 Cato Institute

Peter Asher (09/20/00; 21:56:03MT - usagold.com msg#: 37079)
Phoenix (09/20/00; 17:34:56MT - usagold.com msg#: 37062)
Welcome to the round table.

I have been called many things in life (including all the expletives) but "valorous" my, my: I will not let it go to my head. Strange how our image, created by our written word, can be so different from that of flesh and blood. Valorous indeed, I've been hearing Gandalf laughing all afternoon from 200 miles away up in Seattle. <;-)

I think yours just may be the best first post that ever appeared here, truly. You have a superb writing ability. Also your data on the world of oil is incredible. In fact, regardless of the contest outcome, I now nominate your excellent post to the Hall of Fame.

Well done Phoenix, that's really �Rising' to the occasion!

Aristotle (09/20/00; 21:43:27MT - usagold.com msg#: 37078)
Fading paper
Think objectively-- Instead of getting precious Gold metal, how much would YOU pay for a tin or rusty iron substitute? Then why would you be willing to pay more for a paper substitute?

If it paper you'd rather have, why not just keep the dollars you started with? If it is leverage you want, there are other, more rational avenues that will offer a fair chance of success.

Paper substitutes for Gold (Gold derivatives) have evolved to serve a monetary purpose--and making you rich through facilitating higher prices was not part of that purpose. You see, anyone who has kept their eye on the historical game of monetary systems knows this fully well, and plays their given position ever mindful of the end game scenario. Consider this context, and the purpose of substitutes, when you contemplate FOA's old advice to keep your eye on the game, not on the ball (POG).

Gold. The real thing. ---Aristotle

Peter Asher (09/20/00; 21:37:48MT - usagold.com msg#: 37077)
Shifty, Sancho
There was a T-shirt that the kids wore when they were in a multi-family home school group that read--

"Schooling is not to be cofused with getting an education"

canamami (09/20/00; 21:28:33MT - usagold.com msg#: 37076)
New Book on Gold
This is from the September 20, 2000 Globe and Mail, front page of Section M, concerning what looks like a new, serious book concerning the history of gold. I don't know the perspective of the author, though he wrote the well-known book concerning the role of risk in history, which was very popular a couple of years ago. Here's the description (very brief):

"The Power of Gold (John Wiley and Sons, 432 pages, $38.95) is a sweeping look at the history of the obsession with the precious metal by Peter Bernstein, author of Against the Gods, the fascinating look at risk..."

Leigh (09/20/00; 20:21:13MT - usagold.com msg#: 37075)
***** CONTEST #1 *****
Why do I keep returning to USAGOLD? Because we're not afraid to take on hard topics here. In my day to day life, as I watch and talk with other people, I feel that they're living in a dream world that's about to collapse. I want to warn them, but I know my warnings will go unheeded (at best) or that I will be turned upon. I feel that I'm living in two worlds. One is the surface world of good times and buying and spending. I can function in it, but my mind is almost always elsewhere.

I crave the company of people who are living life in earnest. I want to sit at the feet of those more knowledgeable than I and understand why things are the way they are and whether there is a better way. At USAGOLD I find fellow searchers. The instant comraderie we share is invigorating, and such a relief! At last I feel that I'm on terra firma, and the ironic thing is that the terra firma is in cyberspace!

Some of the things we learn here are frightening. It was a shock to me to learn that our country is bankrupt and that the government survives by stealing from its citizens. ORO opened my eyes to the real story behind land grabs. FOA's scenario of hyperinflation is constantly before me and guides many, many of my decisions.

But we have happy, easy moments here at USAGOLD as well. I have loved every one of the USAGOLD posters from the first time I happened onto this site. Each poster makes a special contribution, and it is heartwarming to see the concern we share when someone is absent. I always feel that I'm among friends here. Though some people would say we're only cyber-friends, we are all flesh and blood people only separated by the happenstance of life. Truly, our inner selves can shine through because we don't have to make allowance for our often clumsy exteriors.

Thank you, USAGOLD, for providing this lifeline to truth, wisdom, and friendship. This is far, far more than a gold site. It is an outpouring of people's hearts and souls.

Bonedaddy (09/20/00; 20:16:04MT - usagold.com msg#: 37074)
Brad, The Believer
Hello, Believer. I'm sorry I missed out on your other posts. I'm reminded of the Captain's immortal words in "Cool Hand Luke":
What we......got ourselves he-ya'....(spits).. is a failya to communicate!
Responses can be rare. Sometimes there is a great deal of banter, other times no feedback. At times, I too have felt ignored, but at least no one can see that my face is red. At any rate, I'm glad that you have resumed your posts.

tg (09/20/00; 20:09:11MT - usagold.com msg#: 37073)
WHO WILL REALLY WIN THE MOST GOLD
gold medals per head of population

USA (population 250 million) 1 gold/5 million people = 50 gold medals

CHINA (population 1 billion), 1 gold/28.6 million people = 35 gold medals

AUSTRALIA (population 18 million), 1 gold/ 1 million people = 18 gold medals

Looks like Australia is by far the winner.

Depends on how you interupt the figures. ( We all know about that :-) )

lamprey_65 (09/20/00; 19:13:49MT - usagold.com msg#: 37072)
Deja vu?
January through early March 1993 - POG trades in a narrow range after a multi-year decline.

3/9/93 - POG break below this trading range to set a new low.
3/10/93 - POG begins a multi-year bull move.

The metal likes to set new lows before rallying strongly -- many examples over the years.

Like I said a few days ago...let's get it over with.

Lamprey

The Believer (09/20/00; 19:00:51MT - usagold.com msg#: 37071)
The Gold "Break Out"
I, a daily reader(and 99% lurker over the last year.I have
posted to this forum six or seven times...but was ignored...
so I gave up) believe that the reason I keep returning to
this Forum, and the one SPECIFIC development that will lead
to the break-out of gold prices will be the problem the
"New World Order" folks have pushing worthless "paper"
down the necks of people that have bought stocks at P.E.s
of 500 or more (much more in some cases as you all must
know by now...((by the way I've made some real nice $
on PALM the last few months...check out the P.E.))and see
their "money" dry up and blow away like the fool choosing
the "fancy" diamond encrusted cup as the real "Grail" in
the now famous movie.(not a palitible sight !)
Come folks...think...I know you don't want to believe it..
but gold won't move until Bill Murphys' foes are facing
criminal charges........!!
The game is afoot....know what you are dealing with...
You know the truth in your hearts...forget about "demand"
for gold...Demand has been outstraping supply for a long
time now...right?
We're going to see BIG problems with the U.S. dollar
before gold will move to a "FAIR" price

Brad -the Believer

SHIFTY (09/20/00; 19:00:33MT - usagold.com msg#: 37070)
Peter Asher
The test
Peter: That was some test.
I failed in a big way!
$hifty

Sancho (09/20/00; 18:11:18MT - usagold.com msg#: 37069)
Peter Asher
Your post #37065 on the high schhool exam of yesteryear was truly fascinating. I just flunked out. So would most people nowadays-society has replaced the "meat and potatoes" with remembering some football players from l957 and exotica from sex education courses.

TownCrier (09/20/00; 17:59:58MT - usagold.com msg#: 37068)
U.S. INTERNATIONAL TRADE IN GOODS AND SERVICES--JULY 2000
http://www.census.gov/indicator/www/ustrade.html
Here's The Tower's breakdown of the significant info in July's trade report...

The U.S. Department of Commerce announced today that the U.S. trade deficit climbed by 6.9 percent over the revised June deficit of $29.8 billion to reach $31.9 billion in July--the highest deficit on record. Our balance of trade suffered a double-whammy as the total value of exports fell by 1.3 billion dollars while our import values gained $0.7 billion.

Trade items of note: The July quantity of imported crude oil (301 million barrels) set a new record high, edging out the previous high June volume. Further aggravating the dollar value of crude imports was the price attached to this record volume. The price of crude oil was up from the $26.65 per barrel price used in June's calculations to $27.76 for July, yet still below the $29.51 per barrel level seen in November 1990 (during the Persian Gulf crisis), and well below the $35 prices that we're seeing today...which bodes ill for future trade figures.

And the issue goes far beyond the dollar-price of energy, because in July we set record deficits with China, Japan, Western Europe and Canada--all distinctly unrelated to OPEC. Traditionally our leading deficit is with Japan (which hit a new record deficit of $7.5 billion), but that was eclipsed by our record deficit with China at $7.6 billion...our largest ever recorded with any single country. Our deficit with our largest trading partner, Canada, grew to a record $4.7 billion, while our deficit with Western Europe swelled to a new high at $7.2 billion.

On that score, the International Monetary Fund issued a new economic forecast on Tuesday in which it cited the rising U.S. trade deficit as one of the primary risks factors for the global economy. The Associated Press quoted Robert Dederick, economic consultant at Northern Trust Co. of Chicago, as saying, "We all know the trade deficit has to subside. The question is whether it will subside in an orderly or a disorderly way. The bigger the trade deficit gets, the bigger the risks that it will be disorderly."

GOLD -- GOLD -- GOLD

While our July gold imports and exports shifted to a near balance for the month, year-to-date figures for these first seven months of 2000 tell a remarkable story, revealing that $3.45 Billion in gold has switched to foreign ownership, whereas during this same time last year only $1.66 Billion had left U.S. ownership.

With cummulative gold exports this year at over double the 1999 value, our offsetting gold imports for this year and last were nearly even at $1.64 billion and $1.71 billion, respectively.

The final analysis is that statistics for the first portion of this year reveal that we have a net loss of $1.8 BILLION in gold. Clearly, the non-U.S. portion of the world still values gold with more reverence than we do in general. Don't let yourself be caught out when, correspondingly, either their faith in the U.S. dollar greatly wanes or our available gold stock is depleted...whichever comes first.

Statistical note: Because U.S. Census Bureau data includes only gold that passes under the purview of Customs, the Commerce Department's Bureau of Economic Analysis adjusts these gold figures to arrive at more suitable accounting for balance of payments to reflect static changes in ownership "in line with the concepts and definitions used to prepare the international and national accounts." To that end, exports are adjusted for gold that is purchased by foreign official agencies from U.S. dealers and held at the Federal Reserve Bank of New York, and similarly, import figures are adjusted to reflect gold sold by such foreign agencies from their stock held at the FRB of NY.

Peter Asher (09/20/00; 17:58:10MT - usagold.com msg#: 37067)
*****Contest****
Yikes, look at the time!!!!
Been reading and posting and where did the day go??

USA 47

China 16

Australia 18

These counties have the affluence or Goernment support to tap large er pools of human bodies.

justamereBear (09/20/00; 17:51:42MT - usagold.com msg#: 37066)
*****contest****
I don't understand the rules exactly. If only one entry is allowed for each of the two questions, then I stand with my previous response to the price of gold question, and this is simply a commentary. If answers are allowed to each question, this is my answer to the question, "Why do I keep coming back"

When I came to the conclusion, in Feb 1987, that the world had reached a major turning point, it became apparent that one should make some plans to insure ones comfort (and indeed survival) during and after the change. (and of course, being human, once having discovered this hoary new truth, I expected it would happen tomorrow, or at least the day after.)

I ran to gold, thinking the question was a financial one only. The market meltdown in Oct 1987, gave me a glimpse of just how inadiquate my thinking was. Certainly I would have been better off than the average bear had that date been the turning point. I began what has since been a continueing research into the state of the world, and a constant polishing and amending of my contingency plans. Events that played out in Russia (USSR) and Japan have given me a better understanding of the scope of the change to come, and some of humanities possible reactions.

When I chanced upon the USAgold site, I was impressed with the MEAT of the content. Some of it I agreed with, some of it I disageed with, but generally it was well argued and thoughtful. Intelligent bunch. I just loved the "Knights of the round table" courtesy. I wish to thank all the people at USAgold for conceiving, and more importantly, managing, the site within these constraints. It is a Herculean task, and you have aquitted it well, better than I would have thought possible. I salute you, Sir, and all who contributed.

When I first got connected with the internet, I chanced upon another site, which I monitored, and eventually made a few postings at. At one point during my lurking, they were invaded by "the god squad". It was interesting to watch the fervor of the ensueing battle. The goldbugs successfully smote the god squad hip and thigh. Humanities bloodiest, most gruesome battles have been about religion.

Your question got me to thinking as to why I actually returned. Of course on the face of it, I was researching for new ideas, and you have to attend the forum to fish for these new ideas, since the come by in a random manner. And there is some truth to that. But, in the last few days, upon the advent of your question, I came to realize that I was also coming, not only for the intelligent debate/ideas, but because of what might be called "misery loves company" or "birds of a feather flock togeather". (and here comes the controversy) I realized, after my experiences with the god squad and the fervor of the goldbug response, that this too was a religion of sorts. People tend to seek out other people who think somewhat like they do, so they can have an "intelligent conversation". That way they are not subject to major putdowns which might call into doubt their basic views.

Belief that mankind will go back to "the gold standard" is based on faith. Religion is also based on faith. And while the goldbug view does have some validity, it is pretty much an axiom that views of the past are an idealized view which accepts the good and pretty much ignores the bad. (and in no way represents the reality as experienced by those who were there)

Mankind tends to forget the bad, mostly. Do you still savour and linger over the time you banged your shin? Of course not, you learned to watch your shins around metal objects. But because it was pleasurable, you do, relatively often, recall that perfect evening where all the world was at peace.

I also come back because birds of a feather flock togeather.

I don't expect to make many more postings, because I have some knowledge of my personality, and it is too easy for me to get addicted to an activity that can be massively time consuming. I do enjoy the majority of the thoughts posted and thank all the contributors, with particular praise heaped on a few who likely know who they are. Certainly the rest of us do.

Peter Asher (09/20/00; 17:46:07MT - usagold.com msg#: 37065)
Once upon a time
Education worked!
Just recieved this by E-mail and therefore there is no link.

>>>>>
> This is the eighth-grade final exam from 1895 from Salina, KS. USA.
> It was taken from the original document on file at the Smoky Valley
> Genealogical Society and Library in Salina, KS and reprinted by the
> Salina Journal.
>
> 8th Grade Final Exam: Salina, KS - 1895 Grammar (Time, one hour)
> 1. Give nine rules for the use of Capital Letters.
> 2. Name the Parts of Speech and define those that have no
> modifications.
> 3. Define Verse, Stanza and Paragraph.
> 4. What are the Principal Parts of a verb? Give Principal Parts of do,
> lie, lay and run.
> 5. Define Case, Illustrate each Case.
> 6. What is Punctuation? Give rules for principal marks of Punctuation.
> 7 - 10. Write a composition of about 150 words and show therein that
> you understand the practical use of the rules of grammar.
>
> Arithmetic (Time, 1.25 hours)
> 1. Name and define the Fundamental Rules of Arithmetic.
> 2. A wagon box is 2 ft. deep, 10 feet long, and 3 ft.
> wide. How many bushels of wheat will it hold?
> 3. If a load of wheat weighs 3942 lbs., what is it worth at 50 cts.
> per bu., deducting 1050 lbs. for tare?
> 4. District No. 33 has a valuation of $35,000. What is the necessary
> levy to carry on a school seven months at $50 per month, and have
>$104
> for incidentals?
> 5. Find cost of 6720 lbs. coal at $6.00 per ton.
> 6. Find the interest of $512.60 for 8 months and 18 days at 7 percent.
> 7. What is the cost of 40 boards 12 inches wide and
> 16 ft. long at $20 per m?
> 8. Find bank discount on $300 for 90 days (no grace)
> at 10 percent.
> 9. What is the cost of a square farm at $15 per acre, the distance
> around which is 640 rods?
> 10. Write a Bank Check, a Promissory Note, and a Receipt.
>
> U.S. History (Time, 45 minutes)
> 1. Give the epochs into which U.S. History is divided.
> 2. Give an account of the discovery of America by Columbus.
> 3. Relate the causes and results of the Revolutionary War.
> 4. Show the territorial growth of the United States.
> 5. Tell what you can of the history of Kansas.
> 6. Describe three of the most prominent battles of the Rebellion.
> 7. Who were the following: Morse, Whitney, Fulton, Bell, Lincoln, Penn,
> and Howe?
> 8. Name events connected with the following dates:
> 1607
> 1620
> 1800
> 1849
>
> 1865 Orthography (Time, one hour)
> 1. What is meant by the following: Alphabet, phonetic, orthography,
> etymology, syllabication?
> 2. What are elementary sounds? How classified?
> 3. What are the following, and give examples of each:
> Trigraph, subvocals, diphthong, cognate letters, linguals?
> 4. Give four substitutes for caret 'u'.
> 5. Give two rules for spelling words with final 'e'.
> Name two exceptions under each rule.
> 6. Give two uses of silent letters in spelling.
> Illustrate each.
> 7. Define the following prefixes and use in connection with a word: Bi,
> dis, mis, pre, semi, post, non, inter, mono'super.
> 8. Mark diacritically and divide into syllables the following, and name
>the
>sign that
> indicates the sound: Card, ball, mercy, sir, odd,cell, rise,
blood,
>fare, last.
> 9. Use the following correctly in sentences, Cite, site, sight,
> fane,fain, feign, vane, vain, vein, raze, raise, rays.
> 10. Write 10 words frequently mispronounced and indicate pronunciation
> by use of diacritical marks and by syllabication.
>
> Geography (Time, one hour)
> 1. What is climate? Upon what does climate depend?
> 2. How do you account for the extremes of climate in Kansas?
> 3. Of what use are rivers? Of what use is theocean?
> 4. Describe the mountains of North America.
> 5. Name and describe the following: Monrovia, Odessa, Denver,
> Manitoba,Hecla, Yukon, St. Helena, Juan Fermandez, Aspinwall and
> Orinoco.
> 6. Name and locate the principal trade centers of the U.S.
> 7. Name all the republics of Europe and give capital of each.
> 8. Why is the Atlantic Coast colder than the Pacific in the same
> latitude?
> 9. Describe the process by which the water of the ocean returns to the
> sources of rivers.
> 10. Describe the movements of the earth.
> Give inclination of the earth.
> ---------------------------------------------------
>Imagine a college student who went to public school trying to pass this
>test,
>even if the few outdated questions were modernized.
>Gives the saying of an early 20th century person that "she/he only had an
>8thgrade education" a whole new meaning!

LeSin (09/20/00; 17:45:27MT - usagold.com msg#: 37064)
Congratulations - USAGOLD Forum - Simply the Very BEST!!
And Apologies for the Triple Post -
Mr, MK & Staff of the USAGOLD Forum - Thank you.

"I pass this way but once and must leave it better than I found it". Or words to that effect, have been said by some one wiser than I. The USAGOLD forum and its participants support that thought and prove it. Cheers "S"

wolavka (09/20/00; 17:35:06MT - usagold.com msg#: 37063)
cassius p.s.
Fast track is much faster than sto or anything on market and you will never see it published.

Remember futures are a zero sums game .

Phoenix (09/20/00; 17:34:56MT - usagold.com msg#: 37062)
"******CONTEST #1*******
If I, a USAGOLD "LURKER" were to name the one specific development or event that would break gold out of this price range, it would be "DEPLETION." After a brief introduction, I will regale you with my theory.

Ahoy, courageous knights and gentle ladies. I am but a mere squire whose heavy broadsword drags against the castle's stone floor. (Sorry about that the damage, Townie, but when you're young and scarred only from the wooden training swords, you tend to overestimate your abilities, especially your strength.) ;-)

Some of the esteemed warriors of the keep are worldly travelers. Many even appear to brandish an education from the Austrian School of Monetary Policy. I prefer the education of the University of USAGOLD, with Michael Kosares, as the quiet President listening to the banter back and forth. Led by Friend of Another, who cloaks himself in mystery and lore, leading us down the path of Middle Eastern psychology. I someday hope that he reveals his identity that I may buy him a cup of mead at some exotic location. The economic wizard, Dr. ORO, teaching graduate level currency dynamics. (Methinks, I need a box or crate to stand on because his wisdom sails over this squire's helmet). Aristotle of Loxly, who gentle tongue and amiable manner disguise a wicked ability to swing a scimitar in battle. The Baroness Leigh, the mighty Usul, the valorous Peter Asher, the jovial Journeyman, and many, many others I neglect to mention have caused this squire to look on the world with much different eyes.

Myself, I remain a yeoman in many of life's intricacies as I find wisdom everywhere and from everyone I listen. I prefer it that way actually. Makes for an interesting walk. My history is of education in the oil patch as an engineer working for an independent oil and gas company in the shadows of the Rockies. However, there's not a day I don't enjoy getting my hands dirty, wielding a current day mace, a.k.a "Pipe Wrench" in one hand and a pair of "Channel Locks" in the other. If Arthur had used such tools, the grail may not have tickled his fancy so much, but I digress...

Since petroleum put coins in my bag, I study the future quite closely and come into contact with sources that garner keen insight on the true workings of the industry. In years past (i.e. pre oil-for-gold), I have always felt that the Middle Eastern countries were absolutely idiotic for not charging more for their finite supply of natural resources. This led me to the musings of ANOTHER at USAGold. The pieces of the proverbial puzzle finally made sense. Whilst we don't know if oil-for-gold is cast in stone, it remains the most logical and sensible conclusion. One a businessman like myself could appreciate. Since then, I've lurked for years on the board never truly needing to contribute. In that regard, the Black Blade is my compatriot in this castle as he does a robust job supplying energy news for consumption.

Excuse me... I tend to ramble on occasion. Enough about me and my foolish ways. Onto my story of DEPLETION, or as I like to think of it, EXHAUSTION. In the oil industry vernacular, DEPLETION is much more pleasant and polite term than exhaustion. In my opinion, DEPLETION will be the key factor raising gold prices in the years to come.

A little explanation. Many of learned folks here know that a newly discovered oil field is a fixed size based on nature's whimsy. What you may not appreciate is that from the first day a well is drilled in an existing field or a new field, it's rate will decline from 2%/year to as high as 20%/year. That causes a well/field producing 1,000 bbls/day to drop to 980 bbls/day (2%) or 800 bbls/day (20%) a year later. That percentage is called the "decline rate," but the loss of the 20 bbls/day to 200 bbls/day is termed DEPLETION. (Take an average percentage and start multiplying the rates out a few years, and you can really see the dramatic impacts in even a few short years.)

DEPLETION would not be a problem if there were a never-ending supply of giant oil fields to discover. Giant oil fields supply most of the world's production, but none have been discovered recently, simply refer to Colin Campbell's masterpiece, "The Coming Oil Crisis." Chances for discovering more of those fields are slim at best. The prime locations have already been checked, drilled, and placed on production and been producing from the �50's.

DEPLETION can be balanced by improving productivity from existing wells, drilling new wells, and secondary recovery methods. However, DEPLETION eventually catches up with each of those activities. Most of the giant oil fields are fully developed in terms of wells and additional recovery methods. Their production rates are falling faster than even 10 years ago.

Onto today and tomorrow, now factor in crude demand growth of 2%/year from 76 MMBOPD to 92 MMBOPD in 2010. Then match it against 98% of current capacity utilized. Oh, and throw in the DEPLETION kicker of 2% to 20% loss for all existing oil production. The difference between demand and DEPLETION needs to be discovered and developed. Don't let your chariot hear these numbers, else its gas tank will gasp in terror.

Now keep in mind, most (read: ALL) Mid-East countries and major oil companies lie about their oil capacity in the ground and their DEPLETION. Recall that Hitler said that a big lie would be believed more easily than a small lie. Reserves and DEPLETION are some the biggest lies (like fiat money, fractional banking, *worthless* gold) perpetuated in the world economy today. Don't believe me, some key statistics are here:

http://hubbert.mines.edu/news/v96n1/mkh-new1.html

It's understandable why OPEC doesn't want the consuming world to know that the cupboard is bare in the future (they say it's a 800-billion bbl 80-year supply.) It's not in their current best interest or their long-term best interest to tell the truth regarding their oil. Simply wait till oil gets reset at a true equilibrium price. All your neighbor's urban assault vehicles will be sitting in driveways with "For Sale" signs faster than Roseanne heading for an all-you-can eat buffet.

This "new reality" won't really hit until OPEC visibly starts losing production year over year at 2% to 20% as OPEC turns to the US with their shoulders shrugged and their pockets outside their pants saying, "Sorry, we goofed." Then governments, media, and people will be saying "Oh, you mean OPEC doesn't have the 80 years of supply like they led us to believe?" This recognition of DEPLETION will dramatically revalue gold to its true equilibrium price (it will be well on its way by then.)

The gold price manipulation will end eventually as we wake up in a world without the oil to match our lifestyles and lacking the replacement energy resources. Time is on your side and DEPLETION is your silent companion on the journey.

I thank each of you for sparing your eyes my way for a few moments of your time. I may pipe up from time to time to draw your attention toward the black gold or musings.

Fly from the Fire,

The Phoenix

PH in LA (09/20/00; 17:32:53MT - usagold.com msg#: 37061)
Interesting gasoline price quotations from DOE.
http://www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/international/gas1.html

Did anyone else notice the following series of numbers while scrolling past most of the posts at Kitco this morning?

Is this evidence of FOA/Another's predicted contention that inflation will impact the US while the Euro zone becomes a stable system with low (or at least lower) price inflation? What say you FOA? Has Kitco poster SDRer uncovered something here? Are these numbers real? Is this already the first manifestations of price stability in the Euro zone while the UK/US/IMF world shifts into inflation overdrive?

Date: Wed Sep 20 2000 01:09
SDRer (CALL TO ARMS, grab your scalpels... ) ID#246299:
Copyright � 2000 SDRer/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
...Please spend some time with these figures [asking pointed questions all the while!] These are Department Of Energy figures.

Weekly Retail Premium Gasoline Prices ( INCLUDING TAXES )

U.S. Dollars per Gallon ( Premium leaded for Belgium, France, Italy, and U.K.; premium unleaded for Germany, Netherlands, and U.S. ) [DOE figures, please note]

Date Belgium
09/02/1996 $4.02
09/09/1996 $4.05
09/01/1997 $3.60
09/08/1997 $3.63
09/07/1998 $3.52
09/14/1998 $3.56
09/06/1999 $3.60
09/13/1999 $3.35
09/04/2000 $3.63
09/11/2000 $3.58
09/18/2000 $3.47
LESS!

Date France
09/02/1996 $4.02
09/09/1996 $4.02
09/01/1997 $3.48
09/08/1997 $3.53
09/07/1998 $3.51
09/14/1998 $3.57
09/06/1999 $3.60
09/13/1999 $3.55
09/04/2000 $3.76
09/11/2000 $3.66
09/18/2000 $3.70
LESS!

Date Germany
09/02/1996 $4.08
09/09/1996 $4.05
09/01/1997 $3.44
09/08/1997 $3.45
09/07/1998 $3.36
09/14/1998 $3.41
09/06/1999 $3.55
09/13/1999 $3.45
09/04/2000 $3.52
09/11/2000 $3.42
09/18/2000 $3.47
LESS!

Date Italy
09/02/1996 $4.20
09/09/1996 $4.21
09/01/1997 $3.64
09/08/1997 $3.68
09/07/1998 $3.63
09/14/1998 $3.69
09/06/1999 $3.70
09/13/1999 $3.64
09/04/2000 $3.75
09/11/2000 $3.64
09/18/2000 $3.63
LESS!

Date Netherlands
09/02/1996 $4.49
09/09/1996 $4.38
09/01/1997 $3.73
09/08/1997 $3.73
09/07/1998 $3.64
09/14/1998 $3.69
09/06/1999 $3.72
09/13/1999 $3.68
09/04/2000 $4.02
09/11/2000 $3.96
09/18/2000 $3.91
LESS!

Date U.K.
09/02/1996 $3.29
09/09/1996 $3.27
09/01/1997 $3.80
09/08/1997 $3.76
09/07/1998 $4.00
09/14/1998 $4.03
09/06/1999 $4.29
09/13/1999 $4.30
09/04/2000 $4.37
09/11/2000 $4.29
09/18/2000 $4.24
M O R E !!

Date U.S.
09/02/1996 $1.38
09/09/1996 $1.38
09/01/1997 $1.42
09/08/1997 $1.42
09/07/1998 $1.19
09/14/1998 $1.19
09/06/1999 $1.42
09/13/1999 $1.43
09/04/2000 $1.71
09/11/2000 $1.74
09/18/2000 $1.73
M O R E!!!

wolavka (09/20/00; 17:09:20MT - usagold.com msg#: 37060)
cassius
What makes a market?

Gold has many faces, she has been in a long cycle downtrend for many years. Most invest on the long side and for security. When we all get too compliant others take us down the trail.

Case in point poor tax slaves of europe,

Market makers , traders , fund mgrs, specs all have different levels of risk and pain.

fast track traders in derivatives will run a market until it shows signs of no longer giving volumne with price.

In golds present state, she has run her course by pushing many out never to return. From a chart stand point she tested support in dec contract 3 times with good buying. Todays price sell off will take out most who expected gold to hold at these levels. It is those who trade the fast track who will position themselves now for an upside move. The critical formula price to fill has been 277.40 based off new york close. Only then with follow thru + volumne will it continue; then you have the potential for a key reversal.

This price was established on may 31st thru 6-5 of this
year.(support) The resistance was and still is 306 and then 325.

Prague is an opportunity for the excuse to fit the chart formation of which I expect they will try to salvage parts of this sick one sided market. Remember strong survive weak die in all industries, business, life in general.
Remember : they fit the news to the math, most media people don't have a clue. (example pork bellies went locked limit because it's the BLT season.) not investment advice, just the way I see it.

RossL (09/20/00; 16:50:44MT - usagold.com msg#: 37059)
SIGN OF THE BEAR
http://www.investech.com/

The "chart of the week" has some interesting analysis this week over at investech.com ... The "gorilla index" chart is from Monday, and we have had two more days of losses since the chart was drawn.

HI - HAT (09/20/00; 16:45:42MT - usagold.com msg#: 37058)
Cassius______Prague
The meeting is of the G-7 finance ministers. Not the IMF.

bravos2all (09/20/00; 16:34:46MT - usagold.com msg#: 37057)
#### GOLD MEDALS GUESS ####
1) United States---> 15 Gold(plated) medals

2) Australia-------> 11 Gold(plated) medals

3) China-----------> 10 Gold(plated) medals

The strength and depth of the United States Olympic Team will continue to dominate.

Australia has the advantage of "home" court and will hang in there.

Good Luck and Bravos to All here at the USAGOLD Discussion Forum !!!

Cassius (09/20/00; 16:32:29MT - usagold.com msg#: 37056)
@Wolavka Something out of Prague???
Sir, Either you're being cryptic again or I'm dull as a dishboard. In any event, Prague is hosting the IMF meeting. Could it be that you're expecting something from that meeting,and if so, why is the $277.40 so crucial as to whether they'll say it or not?.... and, very specifically, what do you expect the announcement to be? Please....
Cassius

AllanC (09/20/00; 16:06:15MT - usagold.com msg#: 37055)
Perplexed #37014
Exceptional!

What I have always wanted to put into words.

Simply Me (09/20/00; 15:58:46MT - usagold.com msg#: 37054)
########### GOLD MEDALS GUESS ############
1. USA...52
2. China...32
3. Australia...26

wolavka (09/20/00; 15:56:36MT - usagold.com msg#: 37053)
nobody likes losing
had a good opportunity to break this mkt wide open today but they sold every uptic.

Broke support on tripple bottom trend line which is now resistance at 274.

They will drop it 2-4 dollars more in dec and then test that 274, if we can break it and close over 277.40 the week end could see something out of prague.

more support @ 268-69 in dec.

Canuck Gold (09/20/00; 14:41:46MT - usagold.com msg#: 37052)
#### GOLD MEDALS GUESS ####
1. United States with 41 Gold (plated) medals

2. Germany with 23 Gold (plated) medals

3. Russia with 19 Gold (plated) medals

Nobody can come close to the strength and depth of the US team. The Aussies got off to a fast start in the pool but they will fade fast. China has lots of depth but no staying power. Russia is a shodow of its former self and will slip to third place with Germany powering through into second place.

CG

Goldfly (09/20/00; 14:32:06MT - usagold.com msg#: 37051)
*****CONTEST #3 **********
1. US 106

Because the USA has the juice.

2. China 55

Too much of their team has been sent home

3. Australia 43

For the fun of it. Sort of like Americans with an accent.

gf

R Powell (09/20/00; 14:15:40MT - usagold.com msg#: 37050)
******* CONTEST #1 ******

If I, a USAGOLD poster, were to name the one specific development or event that would break gold out of this price range, it would be a change in investor sentiment.
Rather than an extraordinary, headline grabbing, single event, the dollar price of gold may move higher with investor buying stimulated by a collective expectation of higher values. Technical traders agree that POG has bottomed and will soon enter a long bull market. This widely held opinion, by itself, may become a self fulfilling prophesy! Many of these analysts have no fundamental knowledge or opinions of the Washington Agreement, the gold carry trade, the gold industry production or any of the multitude of valid reasons why POG is undervalued. This in no way negates their powerful influence in the mechanism that determines the dollar price of gold.
Numerous reasons will be offered for the rising POG after the fact. Many will offer reasons, often discussed here. Many will recite old platitudes. Most of these are valid and will sustain the rising POG to extraordinary levels as will the unwinding of the tremendous short position.
Most analysts will believe (in hindsight) that they foresaw this bull market coming. Most will point out one or more of the many factors accelerating and sustaining the price move as it's cause. This will happen after the never seen change in sentiment has done it's work.
I believe this is now occuring, silently and slowly, and has been, by it's very nature, hidden from sight. This intangible event is truly a wonderful present for all goldbugs. Happy Birthday USAGOLD!

Golden Hook (09/20/00; 13:50:09MT - usagold.com msg#: 37049)
USAGOLD FORUM
Why I keep coming back to USA GOLD FORUM because, It is the only place on the net I see men cry their hearts out as they hope against hope that the next day or next night they will become rich men.

It is a true fact that misery loves company, As misery is spread wide and abroad by certain people on this forum that they have the answer as to why silver, gold and gold stocks don't start goimg up.

It is also a certain fact that there are many wise and educated men here on this board that keep stumbling over the reasons their hard assets are not going.

This is a different time and generations that are investing. Most have heard or been burned in the twenty some year bear markets that have stood in one place.

The dollar, houses,cars and computer stocks are all they read and want to hear about. They are the one reason gold is dead as they sale their parents silver and and gold and other collections into the market. That is where the demand has been reached each year.

Before any hard asset will ever reach the heights like the eighties again will be after a great, I mean great round of inflation or some other accident that will wake them up.

G.

Gandalf the White (09/20/00; 12:53:45MT - usagold.com msg#: 37048)
*****CONTEST #3 **********
***Three, USAGOLD, because of its name, has a special connection with the Olympics. By the end of the Olympic session on Friday, September 22, 2000, the top three nations in terms of Gold Medals won will be

1. _USA 101__

2. _Australia 64__

3. _China 59__

The winner must have both the countries in their proper order AND the exact number of gold medals awarded. The winner will receive a Denmark 20 Kroner Mermaid gold coin and a Denmark 10 Kroner. These entries must be made by Wednesday, September 20, 2000 5 pm MDT. There must also be a short explanation why you think things will stack up as you say.***

****I know this is off subject but that's OK. We have become an international forum and the Olympics are of interest to us all. There will be no runners up.*****
BOOOO! MK, this is totally unfair in that no one but the Wiz has a Crystal Ball and can EXACTLY determine the number of Medals won by the top three country finishers. The Hobbits recommend that the person having the "correct" i-2-3 finishers and the CLOSEST number of Medals to the correct number be awarded a pitence of the USAGOLD Treasury !!!
<;-)>>
Why did these thing "stack up as such" (EXACTLY as the Wiz said) is that 1) the USA had the largest and most diverse team; 2) the Aussies were at home; and 3)the Chinese are still trying to master the language barrier.
===
Thanks for listening.
<;-)

Cavan Man (09/20/00; 12:39:25MT - usagold.com msg#: 37047)
#37046
My apologies to Mr. Duisenberg for misspelling his name.

Cavan Man (09/20/00; 12:35:17MT - usagold.com msg#: 37046)
Cage Rattler
Here in the US we have many "socialists"; would you agree?
I believe the moment of truth is at hand for the Euro/Oil. I cannot see it any other way.

If the Euro is a "different animal" in fiat context, prove it. Conceptually or, at least in keeping with the themes of Duidenberg's recent speech, I suppose the Euro can live in a vacuum. However, we all live in the world of oil. Oil is the lifeblood of our secular existence.

If the Euro is not good for oil settlement it is not good IMHO.

Cage Rattler (09/20/00; 12:24:45MT - usagold.com msg#: 37045)
Oil and euros
Interesting that Euro socialists are now calling for oil to be billed in euros. Ties up to a degree with that earlier CNN article about Iraq and wanting to use euros instead of dollars.

John Doe (09/20/00; 12:24:34MT - usagold.com msg#: 37044)
Please excuse my double post...
....I'll get the hang of it one of these days.

John Doe (09/20/00; 12:08:53MT - usagold.com msg#: 37042)
******CONTEST #1*******

If I, a USAGOLD poster, were to name the one specific development or event that would break gold out of this price range, it would be the enactment of "instructions from above" to begin raising the twice-daily London "fix" in measured increments until a new "equilibrium" price is achieved.

As I hinted previously to another poster, it's not only possible but highly probable that no matter what any miner, any bullion bank, or any private investor does, no matter what the demand and supply situation, what the under- or over-valuation of gold, or what its cost of production, the five participants in the London "Fixing" pool can more or less collude to put the price of AU wherever they reasonably wish. Yes, the price of gold may spike and or down to various levels for assorted and sundry "reasons", but the price can most always be "re-fixed" before the next futures contract rollover.

Now why, one might ask, would anyone ever want to invest in precious metals if the above opinion were actually true? Because, at some point, the "utility" of "fixing" the price of AU will become grossly counter-productive. In the larger scheme of things, and for much of gold's recent history, there always seem to be bigger fish to fry than providing and maintaining a free market in gold. To the powers that be, during the "boom phase", gold is but a tool, a means to an end, to be manipulated and pretty much kept in a box. And these are "boom times" if ever there were.

Gold is "placed", by hook or by crook, where it is most "beneficial". If instruments are required to "balance" the market, or even simply provide the appearance of a "balanced" market, and the old instruments are found lacking, then new instruments will be developed. If old accounting standards raise embarrassing questions as to the "appropriateness" of certain market exposures, then accounting standards will be "relaxed" in order to justify the "appropriateness" of these market exposures. If public "opinion" is unfavorable as to gold's appeal, then public "opinion" will be "shaped" until the proper "opinion" is achieved.

Yet, all "good" things come to an end. At some point, most likely when the boom has been milked for all it's worth, when all have been conditioned to sell gold to those who oversee their conditioning, and when the big lies begin to wear a just little too thin, then gold will be "let" out of its box... for a while. And that eventuality is why gold is a most prudent diversification of anyone's assets.

So much of what goes on in the gold industry (and what passes for economics these days, for that matter) is effect and cause rather than the other way around. A desired effect is instated, i.e., the price of gold is "fixed" at a certain level, and a cause is produced to either explain away the effect (BOE sales) or to encumber the parties that could mostly effectively remove the "effect" (forward selling).

Of course none of these games would be necessary under a free-market system, but except for the politicians, economists, corporate leaders, and the general public, who says we have a free-market system anyway? Few have any illusions here at USAGOLD-- gold probably always has been and probably always will be a manipulated market. But unless things go horribly, horribly wrong, I believe gold will not so much rise on its own, though it certainly has that capacity and inclination, but that it will be "allowed" to rise at the proper time. That time likely not too distant.

HAPPY BIRTHDAY USAGOLD!

RS (09/20/00; 12:04:39MT - usagold.com msg#: 37041)
Perplexed (09/20/00; 01:27:18MT - usagold.com msg#: 37014)
"Why I Return" contest.....
If I may presume to offer a vote,
this entry by Perplexed deserves serious consideration as winner of the contest, if not a place in the Hall of Fame.

Bascom Toadvine (09/20/00; 11:23:35MT - usagold.com msg#: 37040)
Trail Guide
I think the western bankers left the yellow brick road when they saw the "Emerald City" (Wall Street?) of no inflation and a stock market that goes up forever. But now they have fallen asleep in the fields of poppies surrounding the city. What will they find when Glenda the good witch of the north wakes them up?....or will she? They are definitely not in Kansas anymore!

wolavka (09/20/00; 11:17:35MT - usagold.com msg#: 37039)
one for GATA
I'd check out cta's and commodity fund mgrs and ask them why after 20+ years of down mkt why they aren't probing the long side of this mkt???????

Martin Armstrong , if he's still living, could help.

wolavka (09/20/00; 10:52:03MT - usagold.com msg#: 37038)
FINAL BLOW OFF
watch it now!!!!!!!!!

Journeyman (09/20/00; 10:45:57MT - usagold.com msg#: 37037)
QUESTIONS OF THE DAY @ALL
http://www.bog.frb.fed.us/boarddocs/speeches/2000/20000414.htm

There are indeed three "Questions of the Day" below. Excuse the long intro -- not all readers here know all of what I've included. If you know all the background, just skip to the questions!

Before 1913 and the Federal Reserve -- from at least the turn of
the 19th Century (1800) (with only a few hic-coughs, mostly
during the civil-war period) up through about 1912 -- we had what
was called "free-banking" here in the States united. There was
also a long "free banking" period in Scotland and elsewhere.

In the U.s. during this period, the dollar was, by law, an exact
amount of gold. Even in 1933 when USA Corp. under Roosevelt
stole the gold - - - and made it illegal and a "controlled
substance" like cocaine or heroin - - - a dollar was still
_defined_ as 25.8 grains of standard gold or 23.33 grains of fine
gold. That is, a dollar was about .053 ounces of gold.

That's right, the _DEFINITION_ of "dollar" was ".053 ounces of
gold." That and nothing else was a dollar. That's why bank
I.O.U.s, A.K.A. (Also Known As) "bank notes" had printed right on
them "redeemable in gold on demand" in various places and
configurations. Other wise, people simply wouldn't have used
them. Except possibly, as wall (or another kind of) paper.

While there were so-called panics during the U.s. free-banking
period, they were _minor_ hic-coughs compared to what happened
once the so-called "Federal Reserve System" was chartered on the
basis of bogus claims this scheme would end these hic-coughs. In
the so-called panic of 1884, .9% of banks failed; in the 1890
panic, .4% of banks failed; in 1893, 1.9%; in 1896, 1.6%; in
1907, .3%; and in 1914, just after the Federal Reserve Act was
passed. .4% of banks failed.

In the _worst_ pre-Federal Reserve "panic," the panic of 1873,
only 2.8% of banks failed. Contrast that with the approximately
50% of all US banks (~9000 of them) that were unsound in 1933,
under the kindly ministrations of the Federal Reserve just 20
years after it was chartered.

It is this contrast that explains the current Federal Reserve
Chairman's comment, "I am sure that nostalgia for the relative
automaticity of the gold standard will rise among those of us
engaged to replace it." -Alan Greenspan, to American Enterprise
Institute, April 14, 2000 (See link in header for entire speech)

While only gold and/or silver was accepted as true money during
the free-banking period, banks were all completely free to issue
their own brand of handy-dandy, convenient, light-weight paper
"bank notes" as substitutes and claims on the gold "dollars" they
were supposed to be holding in their vaults for you.
Theoretically however, the free banks could issue all the handy-
dandy "bank notes" they wanted to, regardless of the actual
amount of gold they had in their vaults.

QUESTION OF THE DAY ONE: If the banks could issue what were
essentially counterfeit notes at will, why didn't banking and
money completely collapse during this extremely prosperous period
(growth-rate of six or seven percent per year) of over 100 years?
Why didn't these free banks simply print so many un-backed
counterfeit notes that the currency went into hyper-inflation?

QUESTION OF THE DAY TWO: Why did "regulated banking," under
control of the Federal Reserve, turn in such incredibly worse
results -- and manage do it in less than 20 years?

QUESTION OF THE DAY THREE: Did business/government finagled
"regulation" in the form of the Federal Reserve Act improve
banking? (Yea. I know. This one's a throw-away.)

Regards,
Journeyman

wolavka (09/20/00; 10:41:19MT - usagold.com msg#: 37036)
behlim
agreed, but the mkts still trade the stuff. Check out beans today. the ran down from resistance in nov at 515 to fill gap left at 480-85

Now they will run back up to 500 area.

Mkts are made to trade, gold also except gold is special. I like to trade it grab the fiat and then buy the physical , it's a tax free store of wealth that those creatures can't get. Move it off shore in many jurisdictions.

dec gold today is all oversold under 274.this is area which is worth checking out.

No inflation???????? does not matter, oil up here will break alot of people. Other commodities do not have to even move. The effect of just oil will break you.

political scum will tax you to death, you must eliminate them.

Rockgrabber (09/20/00; 10:01:12MT - usagold.com msg#: 37035)
(No Subject)
Do what they must be doing short the paper market and get pysical with the profits for even an extra low price since you helped to make an even lower price

Rockgrabber (09/20/00; 09:59:10MT - usagold.com msg#: 37034)
Help Gold by Shorting it!
Here it is.. Go 4 it short this thing. Do exactly what thye are doing but dont want your help doing. Short this market!! Just cover yourself with a call or 2 and go 4 it!! AHHAHAH Take it down!! Its not cheap enough! Dream come true!

beesting (09/20/00; 09:48:58MT - usagold.com msg#: 37033)
Anglogold Director Urges Gold Miners to Market their Metal!
http://www.anglogold.co.za/subframe_press.asp?pageToDisplay=155
Speaking in Melbourne Kelvin Williams(of Anglogold)said:
To produce Gold and expect someone else to promote it(Gold)to the consumer may prove to be a serious, long term folly.
Click above URL.....beesting.

ski (09/20/00; 09:46:44MT - usagold.com msg#: 37032)
.... Contest #1......

If I, a USAGOLD lurker, were to name the one specific development or event that would break gold out of this price range, it would be a development that is going to take place in another arena and is directly related to gold's sister commodity ..... namely SILVER.

The same thing is going to happen to silver that has already taken place this year to palladium at the TOCOM and platinum at the NYMEX.

At the end of a yet unknown upcoming contract month, in a major commodity trading center, some of the longs (end users of silver like Kodak, Fuji, or Dupont), are going to want their physical silver for production purposes. This time, due to a shortage of the actual physical material, the shorts will not be able to deliver and a default will ensue.

When the silver default takes place, suddenly a new and simple message will pop up in the heads of the presently braindead that says ..... "WHAT'S WRONG WITH THIS PICTURE???" The resulting thinking will push a new herd of individuals across the threshold into wanting to be holders of silver AND gold in various forms.

Behlim (09/20/00; 09:46:06MT - usagold.com msg#: 37031)
wolauka- ag prices
drought in three states, this is true but there is no any price inflation in the agricultural marketplace.

Most every ag product is low at or below the cost of production.

Thanks to the government who seems to like ag subsides to the point that crop surpluses are certain. Either they have to end subsidies, put in place production controls or will go broke drowned by our over production.

I think I'd like to see the end of farm bailout.... the risk/reward gains I believe would raise the price of all ag products much more then production controls....

the government is the only lender who would lend more money to an industry in such poor financial shape

wolavka (09/20/00; 09:37:51MT - usagold.com msg#: 37030)
not hard to see
They hammer every run up, last 12 day closes lower, old russian trick, hammer you down break you. watch for todays close

wolavka (09/20/00; 09:32:48MT - usagold.com msg#: 37029)
low in dec 273.50
need to run up now, need to close 275or better.

USAGOLD (09/20/00; 09:15:31MT - usagold.com msg#: 37028)
Daily Market Report
http://www.usagold.com/DailyQuotes.html
We've had several calls at the office wondering what happened to my Daily Market Reports since they haven't appeared at the Forum. As of a couple weeks ago, I will be posting my articles at the Daily Market Report page only. Please follow the link above. Thank you.

SHIFTY (09/20/00; 09:09:57MT - usagold.com msg#: 37027)
HappyGoldLucky
Welcome HappyGoldLucky
You came to the right place to find out about GOLD.
There are people here that can answer your questions.
Check with our host, I know he can help you.

$hifty

Al Fulchino (09/20/00; 08:35:42MT - usagold.com msg#: 37026)
Perplexed (09/20/00; 01:27:18MT - usagold.com msg#: 37014)
That was beautiful. I am not a judge, but in my book you are a winner.

wolavka (09/20/00; 08:22:58MT - usagold.com msg#: 37025)
3 state drought
damage over 1.5 billion to ags, no inflation here , either, beans falling out of pods, yield , get out shop vacs.

Hillary buy cattle now.

WW Oracle (09/20/00; 08:13:52MT - usagold.com msg#: 37024)
Fascinating news from Bloomberg
http://www.bloomberg.com/emu/emu_news4.html?s=AOciUCxSbR2VybWFu
German bankers saying something should be done to support the euro, but not by buying it up on the market!

wolavka (09/20/00; 08:00:58MT - usagold.com msg#: 37023)
scumballs
keep tryin to test low in dec, time to punish them,

Knallgold (09/20/00; 2:08:47MT - usagold.com msg#: 37021)
@schippi
Why the Gold stocks are doing so badly?
FOA would say "told you so".

LeSin (09/20/00; 01:54:19MT - usagold.com msg#: 37019)
IMF URGES INTERVENTION TO RESCUE EURO

Paris, Wednesday, September 20, 2000
IMF Urges Intervention to Rescue Euro

By Alan Friedman International Herald Tribune

PRAGUE - The International Monetary Fund took the unusual step Tuesday of calling for coordinated intervention by the world's leading central banks aimed at reversing the downward spiral of the European single currency.
In unusually blunt remarks, Michael Mussa, the IMF's chief economist, said, ''I think circumstances where major countries would want to intervene are rare, but you have to ask 'If not now, when?'''

The plunge in the euro - it fell to a new low Tuesday and has lost more than a quarter of its value since its introduction in January 1999 - along with a surge in the price of oil has unsettled financial markets in recent days. Concern is growing that the twin impacts could upset an economic balance that has fueled a period of remarkable prosperity in the United States and resurgent growth in other key markets.

But Mr. Mussa's push for intervention is a loaded challenge to finance ministers from the wealthy Group of Seven nations as they prepare to meet in Prague on Saturday. The Clinton administration has been cool to European requests for a globally coordinated action on behalf of the euro, yet one G-7 official from Europe said the case would be put to Larry Summers, U.S. Treasury secretary, at the meeting Saturday.

Mr. Mussa said the euro's current level meant it was ''significantly misaligned'' against the dollar and the Japanese yen and warned that its weakness could pose a threat not only to Europe itself, but also to the U.S. and Japanese economies.

''I used to say the weak euro is more of an embarrassment than a problem, but recently it has become more of a problem,'' Mr. Mussa said.

In a separate interview, Mr. Mussa, when asked whether the IMF was explicitly calling for the Europeans, the Japanese and the U.S. Federal Reserve to open joint action to prop up he euro, replied ''Yes,'' adding that ''joint action could send a message to the markets that perhaps they have taken some key currency exchange rates too far.''

The European Central Bank, he added, could use interest rate policy ''to be supportive of an intervention.'' The bank, which manages monetary policy for the 11 nations that adopted a single currency in January 1999, has been raising interest rates, a move that is usually supportive of a currency, but the moves have failed to stop the euro's slide.

''It is not only becoming an embarrassment for the new currency, but it is also complicating the issue of monetary policy management,'' he said. Indeed, higher interest rates raise borrowing costs for consumers and businesses, threatening to slow economic growth.

Mr. Mussa said the weak euro was causing the Japanese yen to be so strong that ''there is a sense of concern that this could undermine some of the expansion which is just getting under way again in Japan.''

''In the U.S.,'' Mr. Mussa said, the weak euro ''is a bit less of an immediate concern, but an overly strong dollar can distort the structure of the U.S. economy, and its subsequent correction, if it occurs rapidly, could be a problem as well.''

American officials are thought to doubt that coordinated action can be effective unless and until Europe shows more commitment to overhauling its restrictive labor market and generous welfare systems, which are seen as a barrier to growth. They are also loath to do anything that could affect Wall Street sentiment just weeks ahead of the U.S. presidential election.

And in Berlin, a senior German government official said that it was not up to the IMF chief economist to give advice to the European Central Bank. ''Michael Mussa would do better to concentrate on his own task rather than give advice to the ECB,'' the official said.

At the news conference, ahead of the start of the annual meetings of the IMF and World Bank in the Czech capital, Mr. Mussa also warned that high oil prices could shave between one-quarter and one-half a percentage point off global economic growth next year.

The IMF on Tuesday upgraded its forecast of global growth this year from 4.2 percent to 4.7 percent, and from 3.9 percent to 4.2 percent in 2001. But Mr. Mussa said that growth next year could be affected if oil prices did not come down from current levels of around $35 a barrel.

''The world energy bill has been increased by about $200 billion as a result of the increase in oil prices we have seen since the summer,'' Mr. Mussa said.

In the twice-annual IMF economic forecasts, Mr. Mussa said the United States stood a reasonable chance of achieving a ''soft landing,'' meaning a slowing of the U.S. economy gradually without a risk of recession.

The IMF is predicting U.S. growth this year of 5.2 percent, nearly a full percentage point higher than its forecast six months ago, and it says the U.S. economy will expand by 3.2 percent in 2001.

The IMF also upgraded its forecasts for the 11-nation euro zone, predicting 3.5 percent growth in 2000 and 3.4 percent next year.

Japan, said Mr. Mussa, ''appears to be on course for recovery,'' and the IMF is looking for 1.4 percent growth in 2000 and 1.8 percent in 2001.

The emerging market economies of Southeast Asia that suffered a financial crisis between 1997 and 1999 are rebounding, with an average growth forecast for Indonesia, Malaysia, the Philippines and Thailand at 4.5 percent this year and 5 percent in 2001.

Russia is seen enjoying a strong recovery, helped by higher oil prices. The IMF has revised upwards its forecast for growth this year in Russia from 1.5 percent last spring to a staggering 7 percent at present, and a 4 percent growth rate in 2001.

The IMF projection for China is also higher than it was six months ago, when the forecast for 2000 was 7 percent; now the IMF is looking for 7.5 percent this year and 7.3 percent in 2001.

In Europe, the forecast for Germany, the biggest regional economy, is growth of 2.9 percent this year and 3.3 percent in 2001. France is forecast to grow by 3.5 percent both this year and next, Italy by 3.1 percent in 2000 and 3 percent next year, and Britain by 3.1 percent in 2000 and by 2.8 percent next year.

HappyGoldLucky (09/20/00; 01:39:54MT - usagold.com msg#: 37018)
Buying gold coins
Hi, I am new to gold investing. With stocks so incredibly overvalued and the dollar ridiculously strong, perhaps now is a good time to buy gold as a hedge. The low price of gold suggests as much to me -- $271 a ounce is not very much for the precious metal. However, as someone who has never really examined a gold coin up close, and having to buy through the internet, I was wondering if someone would be kind enough to offer me some tips on what are good choices. For instance, are coins with 0.999 gold content preferred over 0.9111? Does the condition of the coin matter for its resale value, especially for the basic coint types, for example, Gold Eagles, Krugerrands, Maple Leafs, or European coins, etc.Also, is the 1 oz. preferred, or are mixed sizes better. Are silver coins recommended? Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

WAC (Wide Awake Club) (9/20/2000; 3:39:56MT - usagold.com msg#: 37017)
DEMS To Use The IRS To Harass Legal Gun Owners
http://www.yowusa.com/Archive/September2000/20SEP00a/20sep00a.html
DEMS To Use The IRS To Harass Legal Gun Owners
YOWUSA.COM, September 20, 2000
Donna Sands

On February 24, 2000, Democratic Senator Jack Reed of Rhode Island introduced Bill 2099, the `Handgun Safety and Registration Act of 2000'. The bill was read twice and referred to the Committee on Finance. Sine then, the bill was co-sponsored on May 22, 2000 by Democratic Senator Frank R. Lautenberg of New Jersey and Democratic Senator Charles E. Schumer of New York. SB-2099 is currently before the Senate Finance committee and does not require a vote on the floor. If enacted, every honest American gun owner could be targeted for politically motivated tax audits and harassment.

Hard assets...Easy access (09/20/00; 02:20:41MT - usagold.com msg#: 37016)
Centennial Precious Metals, Inc.
http://www.usagold.com/ProductsPage.html
Many feel that the current economic climate portends rising gold prices. If so, you will want to be properly positioned to profit from the trend. For others, especially in potentially volatile times, the preservation of wealth is paramount. In this respect, the role of gold is well known. Whether to profit or to preserve, perhaps the most comfortable portfolio approach is embodied in Robert Frost's poetry: "We will go with you, O wind!"

Diversify. And let the winds carry us where they may.

Let Centennial assist you with all of your precious metals needs. It is your decision to do business with Centennial that makes this website possible. Thanks for your support--past, present, and future.

TownCrier (09/20/00; 01:39:15MT - usagold.com msg#: 37015)
Let the official movements toward international gold transparency continue...
http://www.boj.or.jp/en/about/kaikei/acgsa.htm
Again, you heard it here first...

(July 27, 2000)--Bank of Japan Financial Statement: About Our Gold Sight Account

The Bank of Japan has recently transferred its claims against the Bank for International Settlements (BIS) embodied in a "Gold Sight Account" to a "Gold Ear-marked Account" with the BIS.

Gold sight accounts are offered by the BIS to customer central banks. The Bank of Japan opened its sight account by paying US dollar cash and the BIS purchased gold using the cash.

Sight account holders can withdraw the equivalent amount of gold anytime.

[TownCrier note: This reminded me of an important observation once made by France's own Jacques Rueff in an article he wrote for Le Monde on June 4, 1969 entitled "The Last Twitches of the International Monetary System". In protesting the inflationary flaws of the gold-exchange standard whereby foreign central banks were authorized (and strongly "encouraged" by the U.S.) to hold dollars among their assets while the gold remained in use as a reserve asset of the United States. While these foreign held dollar claims accumulated through the 1950s and 1960s, Mr. Rueff said, "Simple juxtaposition of these figures [foreign dollars against U.S. held gold] underscores that reimbursing the gold claims that encumber the dollar has become not only imposssible, but inconceivable, notwithstanding the immense power of the American economy. I know that this view will come as a surprise to those who are aware of the wealth of the American continent. Let them remember, however, that sight liabilities are met out of foreign-exchange holdings, not out of investments, and that banking catastrophes nearly always result from a SHORTAGE OF LIQUIDITY RATHER THAN FROM A LACK OF ASSETS. [my emphasis]"
+
That is an important concept for people to learn who are prone to suggest that an "overhang" of above-ground or official-sector gold precludes runaway prices and a bullion banking crisis.]

On the Bank of Japan's balance sheet, the claims embodied in the Gold Sight Account had been booked classified as "foreign currency assets (foreign currency deposits)". After transferring to the Gold Ear-marked Account, however, the claims are now booked as "gold" together with the existing gold holdings by the Bank. It is for this reason that the Bank of Japan's gold balance has increased by 11,651,494 thousand yen as shown in the "Bank of Japan's Accounts" as of July 20, 2000. As such, the transfer and associated change in our account are purely technical in nature and do not involve any new purchase of gold.

[TownCrier note: Can anyone pick the day the BOJ will take these more visible gold assets and mark them to new market values?]

Perplexed (09/20/00; 01:27:18MT - usagold.com msg#: 37014)
Why I return
**********CONTEST**********

I, a USAGOLD poster , ( Fill in the blank -- a "poster", or a "lurker"), keep returning
to this Forum because:
In my view, the beings created in the image and after likeness of God, were created to the role of information gatherer by means of experiences. In order to fulfill my
function and advancement in the plan, I consider it my obligation to acquire the competence to, (as infallibly as possible) recogize truth. In a word-- EDUCATION.
Because a portion of my time--a gift from my creator, and my most valuable wealth, must be traded for currency, which then must be traded for my personal needs, anything less than an absolutely stable currency equates to grand larceny. Gold--recognized as wealth itself, qualifies.
Once my gift of time is taken from me, my quest is no more, therefore, along with the gift came the responsibility of preserving it. And, because my creator would not
burden me with an impossible task, the means of defending my life and welfare was not denied me.
As previously stated, the purpose of my being, is the gathering of information by any means which I deem appropriate, this means that I must have the freedom to move as I so desire, have access to any and all information, and freedom of association.
This translates SELF DETERMINATION. An attribute of my creator, transfered to me as a responsibility, and, according to the American Declaration of Independence, to
facilitate the responsibility and SECURE THESE MEANS, governments are created among men (mankind) deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed (each
individual).
We are literally awash in a sea of information, some correct, some erroneous, some erroneous by intent. For anyone with a true desire to know the answer to any question, the only requirements are an open mind and the willingness to invest the necessary time reading, compiling, analyzing, and correlating this glut of information. They must also be willing to examine, disect, and if necessary, unlearn previous "truth".
Because I recognize the limits on my time as well as education, and am not to proud to accept help from any of my present day fellow travelers, this Forum draws me like a bee to a honeysuckle vine, and a pirate to the Spanish plate fleet.
Because we have all acquired information, in a different, manner, under different circumstances, and even as different genders and nationalities, I am assurred of acquiring a treasure trove of varying-- sometimes conflicting, (though not necessarily wrong) opinions, from which I may furthur my eternal goal. YOU GUYS AND GALS
MAKE IT EASY.
The equality of all humankind expressed within The Declaration of Independence became a filter within my mind, through which all information passes. If an event does not
serve to bring us closer to the ideals of individual self determination for all mankind, then as far as I'm concerned, it does not meet the standards of truth required within that document.
My heart felt thanks to all my friends on this Forum, especially to Micheal and all the staff of Centennial. And to all you lurkers? They say that a stranger is just a friend that we havn't met. Looking forward to meeting you on the Forum.

Normally Perplex--but not about this

TownCrier (09/20/00; 01:01:56MT - usagold.com msg#: 37013)
Hear ye! Hear ye! A call to contest! Another contest deadline approaches this afternoon!
http://www.usagold.com/acontest.html
Click the link to see the contest rules, and let the games continue!

To celebrate the approach of September 22nd, marking the second anniversary of the birth of the Forum here at USAGOLD, we have organized several games of skill and luck for your participation...with prizes of GOLD to be awarded to the several winners.

The deadline for Contest #1 approaches Friday, with the top prize being the coveted Uruguayan Five Peso gold coin on the line, and tenth ounce gold bullion coins for the two runners up.

Contest #2 has reached the entry deadline and is closed. (see link for the list of qualifying participants)

The deadline for the contest #3 (Olympic medal winners) approaches this afternoon at 5:00 pm Mountain Time (17:00 Forum time). There is a Denmark 20 Kroner Mermaid gold coin AND a Denmark 10 Kroner on the line for a winning entry. See the link above for complete contest rules.

ViewYesterday's Discussion.

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